Video Games

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 3:32 am

Heroes 3 tends to be considered the best and most complete game in the series while 2 is something of a sentimental favorite because of the opera music and otherwise being lovably cheesy. It didn't take itself very seriously at all, and it was to the game's credit.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:36 am

Heroes 3 is a lot like Heroes 2 but with prettier graphics, more factions, more balanced factions, and various minor improvements it will take you a long time to notice.

Heroes IV is in almost every way a step backwards. It switched to a weird 3d graphics thing so everything looks shiny and clunky and a whole lot worse. It brought the number of factions down to five, and did this thing where you have binary choices at each level of whether to build awesome creatures or less awesome creatures that ends up locking out a lot of the content. Also, Death Town >> You. It's still fun, for a while, but the late game really drags hard. Also, they do this thing where your heroes are actually units on the field, and the end result is that in the late game your hero's stats don't even begin to keep up with the giant army sizes and your hero just hides in a corner and tries to exploit glitches in the computer code to keep the giant enemy stacks from casually wiping out out your hero. I completed some of the campaigns.

Heroes V was basically unplayable on release. It's the first offering by Ubisoft, and shows how fucking terrible they are as a company. Eventually they released some expansions that completely overhaul the game mechanics, and make something that is actually OK out of the hot mess they had on release. But it's still not particularly great. Mostly goes back to Heroes 3 mechanics, and places where it doesn't (ex.: using squares instead of hexes) are definitely not an improvement. Still actually doesn't look as good as Heroes III, which was and is offensive and ridiculous.

vs.

Heroes VI is a completely unplayable mess. As in: it is literally impossible to play. Ubisoft installed special DRM that won't let you play the game if their server can't make a continuous stable connection with your computer during the single player fucking game. Also there is very little content, so even if you could play the game you'd get bored pretty fast. And the pathing doesn't work properly so you have to move your character in baby steps and they have the walking speeds turned down way too low so everything takes a fuckoff long time. And and and. Really deserves its own thread about how fucking awful this game is. It is however, the prettiest game in the series, hands down. Thumbs up to Puppet Works (the contractors that did the graphics), thumbs down to everyone else involved (Ubisoft, Black Hole, etc).

-Username17

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:34 am

I now sort of feel bad about grabbing HoMM5 now, but Steam didn't have 3. Still, I'm sure I'll get some enjoyment out of it, and it didn't cost much.

DSMatticus · Post by **DSMatticus** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:56 am

Steam tells me I put 23 total hours into HoMM5. That is probably more than it warrants, and is also nowhere near the amount of time I put into HoMM2&3. But it's a respectable amount if you got it cheap, I suppose.

Istred · Post by **Istred** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:42 am

Eh, Heroes V with the expansions isn't that bad - nowhere near HIII level obviously, but still I'd rate it as far superior to HIV and VI.

And while I agree the newest game is the best looking - though I hate how over the top some units are and how the factions became color coded (toxic green? must be necropolis. Burning red? Inferno. Purple? Dungeon*). Also, Ubi could have given a bit more cash for the units - we have water and light elementals doubling as units in the factions and the dragon model was repainted and used five or six times.

*apart from the Black Dragon which is all golden and glowy

Shatner · Post by **Shatner** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 4:11 pm

The Heroes IV campaigns had, all things considered, good writing, which is not something I can say stood out for any of the others. Seriously, Gauldoth the Half-Dead is the model of the sane leader of a Necropolis. He forms a city-state out of refugees, animating the corpses of his enemies and the citizenry who die naturally. The dead become both army and unskilled labor force while the living become skilled labor, necromancers, and (eventually) more bodies. He recognizes that the undead rely on the living to increase their numbers so he welcomes the living into his lands. And he uses ice demons (because Necromancers get those for some reason in Heroes IV) to maintain a giant morgue/meat locker to house the dead the necromancers haven't gotten to yet.

When his pet tactician (a specter who is constantly engaging in Batman-esque "how do deal with X" scenarios concerning the neighboring nations) reveals a route of attack that would cripple the adjacent Haven nation (i.e. Angels and Holy people), Gauldoth sends the plans TO the Haven nation along with an offer for a non-aggression pact. "Nothing unifies people quicker than a Necromancer conquering the living."

Eventually Gauldoth's old master shows up and goes on the standard "the dead will consume the living" rampage, and Gauldoth eventually takes his crusty ass out for being the backwards relic that he is.

Any game that can give the undead a non-angsty treatment where they are smarter than a Bond villian is fine in my book. The narratives for the other factions were, to varying degrees, also good but it was the undead one that stood out.

Istred · Post by **Istred** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 4:22 pm

Shatner wrote:The Heroes IV campaigns had, all things considered, good writing, which is not something I can say stood out for any of the others.

This I cannot deny. The writing was - as far as the series goes - a shining example of how to do things. If only the game itself was better... And seeing the writing in 5&6 we can be sure that as long as Ubi holds the license, no game in the series will get above "crappy-mediocre writing" level...

because Necromancers get those for some reason in Heroes IV

For the same reason they got Kreegans - now, if we only knew what it was...

One nitpick - it was the Academy (wizards, titans etc) faction, not the Haven one.

Though Gauldoth had a bit of what you'd expect from a necromancer in him - animating the remains of a holy warrior and ordering the creature to kill all monks in a monastery or razing down a village and animating all the corpses as an act of revenge.

Darth Rabbitt · Post by **Darth Rabbitt** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 1:37 am

I actually beat Mortal Kombat 2 without cheats!

(See Shrapnel's "games that were designed to cause pain" thread for more from me on MK II's difficulty, which inspired me to try the game out again.)

I have to thank you, shau, for the advice with Baraka; his blade spinning attack does out-prioritize Kintaro's stomp (but not his throws.)

Shao Kahn is actually a huge wimp in this game; I lost the first round to him (the first round I've ever fought him without cheating, since Kintaro is so damn hard) and then fucking destroyed him in the next two.

ALL HAIL KING BARAKA

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:38 am

Briefly started Heroes 5 and yeah... I'll go through the tutorial campaign and then play around a bit, I'm sure it'll be more fun once you're dealing with city-building and resource management. The fights just don't seem very good (Heroes 2 was more fun in that regard), and the "hero rides up and attacks" animation is time-consuming and awkward-looking. Bonus points for just sailing through terrain that apparently is just an illusion.

Meanwhile, I might be going overboard with status effects and skills in the test game I'm making with RPGmaker. On the grounds that I elected not to do something simple and small. But it's fun, still.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:45 am

Koumei wrote:Meanwhile, I might be going overboard with status effects and skills in the test game I'm making with RPGmaker. On the grounds that I elected not to do something simple and small. But it's fun, still.

Are you doing everything with the default tileset and sprites, or are you importing new resources? I want to do something where the main character is some kind of awakened mummy, and I'm still trying to figure out what my approach is going to be graphically.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 6:04 am

So far I have imported some enemy sprites, used the character portrait maker to create the player characters (though I'll probably add some more pieces in, there is a lack of good mouths), added in a few icons of my own...

I'll be adding to it in bits and pieces as I go along.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:50 am

Huh. Finding a decent mummy was actually surprisingly easy. Just had to spend a couple minutes in GIMP adapting the image file. Once I remove some dead pixels tomorrow, I'll have a perfectly functional protagonist sprite.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:08 am

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/article ... ir-275-nes

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:19 am

I already feel that for $15 I didn't get my money's worth with Heroes 5. I can't be fucked with the first campaign, particularly given mission 2 is "capture X in one week. We're not telling you where in the fucking map X is, and you'll basically have to intuitively take the right path there with no detours".

Which is a problem, given it's a requirement for the other campaigns. And there are about eight non-campaign single-missions which are all annoying in their own way, and apparently no map/mission creator like Heroes 2 had.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:32 pm

So, anybody else tried out Shadowrun Returns yet?

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 2:35 pm

Well, I mig-
*glances at the literally more than a dozen old games purchased in summer sales, then the JRPG series being played through on an emulator*

Maybe next year.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:33 pm

i'll be honest here:
sadly, it's worth the steam asking price.
nowhere near what i gave them on kickstarter though i am afraid <.<

people are bitching about the save-system. bullshit i say, weak ass pussy-gamers.
people are complaining about no loot. yes, i am with them on this one.
the story is sadly pretty linear and character creation and advancement are very limited.
gear is very limited as well.
everybody can awaken by expending karma, though essence-loss makes magic harder . .
only very little cyber later on in the game and it's mostly useless and also limited in what you can install because they are working with a slot system <.<

Istred · Post by **Istred** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:35 pm

Koumei wrote:I can't be fucked with the first campaign, particularly given mission 2 is "capture X in one week. We're not telling you where in the fucking map X is, and you'll basically have to intuitively take the right path there with no detours".

There is the small fact that at the point you could take the wrong path you have an observatory, which will reveal enough of the map to show the objective...

and apparently no map/mission creator like Heroes 2 had.

Map editor was added in one of the patches - you should have it.

Foxwarrior · Post by **Foxwarrior** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:40 pm

I've tried out Shadowrun Returns too, Stahlsteele. Given that it's mostly about carefully reading dialogue, the lack of voice acting may be its biggest flaw.

So far, the XCOM-style combat, while it spends less time on irrelevant animations than Enemy Unknown does, has not posed any real challenge.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:53 pm

*nods*
i have no problem with reading. i love reading. not like the COD idiots it seems.
i only died once yet and that was a close call . .

also:
WH40K the MMO is dead! Long live WH40K the MMO!
Yep, Dark Millenium Online went to Dark Millenium Offline.
Then it went to No Millenium At All it seems right now.

And then this happens for some reason:
http://www.eternalcrusade.com/
honestly, i am not sure what to think about this right now . .

Sigil · Post by **Sigil** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:25 pm

I noticed that Shadowrun Returns is a Steam Workshop title. Those of you who have played it, do you think the core of the game has enough interesting mechanics for some good mods to come out for it, or would the combat and gear mechanics not allow for enough variety?

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:55 pm

i'm not sure how far you can change mechanics of the game.
rumors have it that the editor is supposed to be pretty mighty.

there's already an alpha of a reboot of the 1991 SNES game on steamworks.

Foxwarrior · Post by **Foxwarrior** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:15 pm

Well, the combat mechanics do have a couple of significant disadvantages relative to XCOM, (there doesn't seem to be any terrain destruction, XCOM's contrived mechanic where enemies who appear for the first time can't attack you until you've taken a turn was actually pretty good at making the extremely lethal game less swingy), but XCOM doesn't have a level editor, and I'm pretty sure you could still make a bunch fun battles and branching stories in this one if you put some effort into it.

Rawbeard · Post by **Rawbeard** » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:08 am

SR Returns is buggy as fuck. Still fun, sorta, although it could be slightly less linear. Even dialogue options via charisma ettiquette unlocks don't get you anything, other then some flavor text that dump you right back to the same solution every other idiot has to make.

I would also like it more if it wasn't UB storyline sprinkled with immortal elf fan wank with a side dish of Lofwyr via Hans Brackmann.

Fun fact! Deckers are as pointless to bring along as in the TTRPG, only having an optional hacking map of their own once in a full moon and you get NPC hackers (lawl) to do the mission critical shit. The way it get's handled once it happens is solid, though. Kinda. As solid as XCom clones can be, I guess.

Fun fact two! Play this game if you ever wanted to see Harlequin getting his ass handed to him in melee by some random dudes. Funny as hell.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:49 am

i am surprised to see that many people playing this game outside of the normal shadowrun boards o.O
also, i ain't that far yet. i just died for the second time in the whole game while trying to do the renraku run.