Pathfinder Is Still Bad

hogarth · Post by **hogarth** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:04 pm

Lago PARANOIA wrote:This is assuming that Pathfinder actually seriously wanted to fix the issue of Linear Warriors Quadratic Wizards. I know more than a few people that are mortally offended by the thought of non-magical people being equal to the magical people.

I think it's clear that they never intended on making any fundamental changes to 3.5, considering their target audience was people who liked playing 3.5. Why gamble on something completely new when you can make a few superficial changes and just advertise it as new instead?

Midnight_v · Post by **Midnight_v** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:49 pm

On some level I think Hogarth is right... ,but with the ferocity that the "Right" changes were attacked, and the questionable reactions of Jason "Bullshitman" B. It seems to me there was a personal investiture and high mindedness that I've always concluded came from the idea that he/they were on to something great. . .
... maybe he's just got some impossible ego on him... I guess that could be it too. Can't say, not enough evidence.
As for the "At what poit did you know", I knew when I read the advertising line from the begining when they said Fixed D&D + Backwards compatability/Use your old stuff. The open playtest results just proved something was wrong, but it was the initial lie that set off alarms all over my mind.

Datawolf · Post by **Datawolf** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:16 pm

Shit like this and this really irritate the fuck out of me. It's like these knobby bone chokers have forgotten that you can just take ranks in Bluff, Intimidate and Diplomacy to better your social skills. Also, there's some rectal ranger in the second thread who thinks it's a good idea for elves to dump Constitution.

Thing about this stuff, though, is that it just highlights the problems with Paizo's playerbase and not their system... of course these are the types of people who have no idea why Pathfinder is a poor system...

You guys are already aware of this fucknuttery, so I apologise for being redundant. I just had to get this out of my system because it pisses me right the fuck off.

If you don't want people dumping charisma, alter the game's mechanics so that it's useful to everyone.

hogarth · Post by **hogarth** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:36 pm

Datawolf wrote:Shit like this and this really irritate the fuck out of me. It's like these knobby bone chokers have forgotten that you can just take ranks in Bluff, Intimidate and Diplomacy to better your social skills. Also, there's some rectal ranger in the second thread who thinks it's a good idea for elves to dump Constitution.

Thing about this stuff, though, is that it just highlights the problems with Paizo's playerbase and not their system... of course these are the types of people who have no idea why Pathfinder is a poor system....

Yeah, there's nothing particularly Pathfinder-ish about those threads; they'd be complaining about the same thing in 3.5 as well, I assume.

K · Post by K » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:11 pm

Datawolf wrote:Shit like this and this really irritate the fuck out of me. It's like these knobby bone chokers have forgotten that you can just take ranks in Bluff, Intimidate and Diplomacy to better your social skills. Also, there's some rectal ranger in the second thread who thinks it's a good idea for elves to dump Constitution.

Thing about this stuff, though, is that it just highlights the problems with Paizo's playerbase and not their system... of course these are the types of people who have no idea why Pathfinder is a poor system...

You guys are already aware of this fucknuttery, so I apologise for being redundant. I just had to get this out of my system because it pisses me right the fuck off.

If you don't want people dumping charisma, alter the game's mechanics so that it's useful to everyone.

There really is nothing to be done for the people that think that a you should ignore the rules for social checks and RP CHA as the only stat that counts.

I mean, your social ability is supposed to be your social skills plus stats plus mods, meaning the CHA 18 guy with no skill or mods is supposed to be vastly inferior to the guy with ten ranks and Cha 6. Those are the rules and we can discuss changes to the rules to make that not true, but they aren't doing that.

So I don't know what to say. Not being rational means I can't even argue with you. These are the same people who think Monks are overpowered because they can fight without weapons and that Factotums are uber-powerful because once a day they can do something cool, and they won't listen.

They don't even care about balance, but they insist that their opinions on game balance be heeded and offended when you suggest otherwise.

Aharon · Post by **Aharon** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 8:39 am

Nitpick:
I thought the Factotum thing was 1/encounter? (=> costly extra standard actions) That's not uber-powerful, but it's a neat trick that gets online around the same time as wizard extra actions via celerity.

Juton · Post by **Juton** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:26 am

Factotums can get a lot of extra actions, but they run out of spells really quick. They get something like 8 spells per day at level 20, not 8 spells per level but 8 spells in total.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:24 pm

The thing about low Cha is the only difference between 3.5 and PF there is in PF you'll have 1 less Cha, because it gives you 2 more bonus points for no real loss. That's all there is really. Otherwise, it's the typical Paizil Fuckwit mindset, where doing anything they don't like, be it having a low Cha because Cha is worthless, ignoring traps because traps are worthless, or playing in any way other than the way they want leads to them trying to get you. This is the main reason why Kingmaker is a fail module, without very strict rules such behavior is encouraged.

And at the same time they bitch at optimizers, claiming they're the ones pulling the One True Way card. Look in the fucking mirror you damn Paizils.

Also, getting a kick out of how they're shoving it to beatsticks, while at the same time they claim this isn't Caster Edition.

Datawolf · Post by **Datawolf** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:14 pm

Thanks for being merciful. Once again I apologise for lowering the quality of this thread. I've stopped crying now.

Just breathe... the Paizils can't hurt you anymore... just breathe...

Josh_Kablack · Post by **Josh_Kablack** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:53 am

Pathfinder Engrish gets down to some dogrape

TheWorid · Post by **TheWorid** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:11 am

This series just keeps getting better. Bravo, Japan.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:34 pm

Datawolf wrote:Thanks for being merciful. Once again I apologise for lowering the quality of this thread. I've stopped crying now.

Just breathe... the Paizils can't hurt you anymore... just breathe...

You'll feel better once you start smiting them.

Slade · Post by **Slade** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:28 pm

Josh_Kablack wrote: Pathfinder Engrish gets down to some dogrape

The episode is very mature content (lol). Apparently, griffon island can cause dog sex due to magic alchemy or something.

I'm sad that Hilda didn't fall for a PC: the wizard and her should be shipped.

Psychic Robot · Post by **Psychic Robot** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:15 pm

You'll feel better once you start smiting them.

Disagree. That just results in greater quantities of fail and threadlock.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:20 am

I really want to do the Pathfailure Adventures style-thing with my IRC game. It's a shame I'm lazy though. But it would be awesome, complete with Bad Engrish.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:20 am

Psychic Robot wrote:
You'll feel better once you start smiting them.
Disagree. That just results in greater quantities of fail and threadlock.

Smiting cures fail. And cancer. You should know that.

Count Arioch the 28th · Thu Feb 17, 2011 3:05 pm

Roy wrote:
Psychic Robot wrote:
You'll feel better once you start smiting them.
Disagree. That just results in greater quantities of fail and threadlock.
Smiting cures fail. And cancer. You should know that.

I believe evidence supports that having strongly worded arguments thrown at you makes the average person MORE secure in their position, not less.

The whole "suck on a barrel of cocks" meme we have here might be direct, but evidence suggests that it's an ineffective way to get someone to agree with you.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:48 pm

That's funny, because it's worked before, multiple times. Sure, it makes Ferrous Cranuses not change, but then again everything else does the same thing to them, and smiting them at least makes it clear their behavior is unacceptable, and also marks them as undesirable so that other people can disregard them.

Count Arioch the 28th · Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:57 pm

Roy wrote:That's funny, because it's worked before, multiple times. Sure, it makes Ferrous Cranuses not change, but then again everything else does the same thing to them, and smiting them at least makes it clear their behavior is unacceptable, and also marks them as undesirable so that other people can disregard them.

Usually when I make strong arguments, I just get ganged up on. I try to avoid them these days because I hate being ganged up on.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:16 pm

There's a Tome feat for that.

Count Arioch the 28th · Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:26 pm

Roy wrote:There's a Tome feat for that.

I don't have the "Awesome" tag, I don't actually have any feats.

RobbyPants · Post by **RobbyPants** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:55 pm

Are you a construct or vermin?

Finkin · Post by **Finkin** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:47 pm

Roy wrote:That's funny, because it's worked before, multiple times. Sure, it makes Ferrous Cranuses not change, but then again everything else does the same thing to them, and smiting them at least makes it clear their behavior is unacceptable, and also marks them as undesirable so that other people can disregard them.

Sure you can try that over on the Paizo boards, but whenever I see anyone attempt to smite down something incorrect or out of whack with their system all of the smiting and the correct information it accompanies is simply drowned out in all of the noise created by the army of white knight cockroaches that crawl out by the dozens to defend their beloved system of fail.

Roy · Post by **Roy** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:09 pm

Finkin wrote:
Roy wrote:That's funny, because it's worked before, multiple times. Sure, it makes Ferrous Cranuses not change, but then again everything else does the same thing to them, and smiting them at least makes it clear their behavior is unacceptable, and also marks them as undesirable so that other people can disregard them.
Sure you can try that over on the Paizo boards, but whenever I see anyone attempt to smite down something incorrect or out of whack with their system all of the smiting and the correct information it accompanies is simply drowned out in all of the noise created by the army of white knight cockroaches that crawl out by the dozens to defend their beloved system of fail.

And they have all manner of products for that. Starting with flamethrowers. Because everything is better with more fire.

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:25 am

Smiting (at least Den-style) only works when you outnumber the target. Even then, it's a toss up whether they actually change their position, just stop talking about it, or get angry and leave.
It can be entertaining, at least. But some threads here have way the fuck too much - like pouring a whole salt shaker on your food. When every second post is about how the other posters are malevolent retards, that gets old fast.