The Gaming Den

Does anyone else feel bored and disengaged by the number of franchises in games like Super Smash Bros. and Namco vs. Capcom?

I mean, it was cool when it was just Snake as the outlier but there was a real tonal and aesthetic consistency in Brawl that the follow-up games just don't have. It really feels like Ready Player One, and not in a good way.

I hated the "realistic" aesthetic that Brawl had. The Wii was the not the system to try that on.

Personally, I enjoy a large representation in Smash. It makes the games more diverse and interesting, and I think that the more characters that aren't solely Nintendo based (or even just from Mario or Pokemon) allows the game to have wider appeal.

Lago PARANOIA wrote:It really feels like Ready Player One, and not in a good way.

Is there even such thing as a good way to feel like that shite?

Anyway, it's kind of hard to limit Smash to a small subset of things and also keep updating it and churning out new iterations. And the latter is necessary A) for Nintendo to keep making money off purchases (what with them being one of the last companies to do the "here buy the game, now it's yours" approach rather than "live seeeeervices"), and B) to try dissuading incredibly smelly people from dragging their 13th century consoles and CRT TV sets to gaming competitions like Evo.

King of Fighters started as SNK vs SNK, and it has grown by having an actual storyline of its own to connect game to game (as stupid as that story can be, what with it being a fighting game) and basically consuming the souls of the franchises that went into it. So you don't also have a new Fatal Fury game (I mean there's a new Samurai Showdo... Shodown. It's actually Shodown. Not Showdown. Never mind, there is a new one of those and that's weird). It can make its own new characters up.

Capcom Fighting Jam/Evolution started as Capcom vs Capcom, and it then died and was forgotten and that is probably for the best. We no longer need discuss Capcom. (Okay fine, Marvel vs Capcom got tonally weirder over time but again it was that or "stop making new games" and honestly, ever since they went 3D I wish they had taken that approach).

For Smash to keep going, it basically has to swallow up new IPs like Kirby with enemies. Or really start digging into Nintendo's bizarre past and try to make people give a shit about the ancient things like Super Chilly Chums apparently it was called Snow Brothers in most of the world.

The other options would be to take the KoF approach, kill off a lot of the properties within it (so the ongoing Mario universe is just the Smash universe. Yeah go on, try selling that idea to anyone, and telling them there will be no more Mario platformers) and adding new "exclusive to Smash" characters, or making a whole bunch of new IPs and games that feel very Nintendo just so they can be added to Smash. Which seems to be what happened with the fighty arms boxing thing? Was it just called Arms? People were super excited about that back with the Switch unveiling video and seeing that TwinCheeks character, and since then... nothing. Splatoon at least held strong as its own set of games even if it probably was made so they would have new Smash characters.

Smash Bros is great because it's about the characters

that shit book is about a shit author insert character of an author who waxes poetic about gamer girls or something

I like crossovers, but they're good as one-off events or in situations where you don't care about the plot/universe.

Generally speaking, a fictional universe is made to be consistent and tell a specific story/kind of story. Most of the time, you lose all this once you mix multiple fictional unverses together.
For video games, this applies to gameplay as well. It's fun to be able to play Simon Belmont or Samus in mario levels, but the game is no more what you expect from a mario game.

Blade wrote:It's fun to be able to play Simon Belmont or Samus in mario levels, but the game is no more what you expect from a mario game.

That sounds like a better version of Mario 2, where everyone has a weird way traveling/fighting.

I think the major problem with crossovers is that people expect it to make sense or be taken seriously. They're taking a game about a magical plumber who smashes things with his ass while doing mushrooms, and they're making it weirder. It should be a stupid idea taken to the point that it somehow works. If someone complains about it not being realistic or making sense, we should exile them to their own island, not make the game something they'd like.

Koumei wrote: The other options would be to take the KoF approach, kill off a lot of the properties within it (so the ongoing Mario universe is just the Smash universe. Yeah go on, try selling that idea to anyone, and telling them there will be no more Mario platformers)

There will be no more new Mr-Game and Watch games besides Smash.

There will be no more new Ice Climbers games besides Smash (actually there was only one).

There will be no more new R.O.B games besides Smash

There will be no more new Earthbound games besides Smash

There will be no more new F-Zero games besides Smash.

There will be no more Banjo-Kazooie games (Microsof not looking like they're gonna do anything with the IP anytime soon at least) besides Smash.

A lot of the franchises in Smash are already dead outside of Smash itself.

Koumei wrote: and adding new "exclusive to Smash" characters, or making a whole bunch of new IPs and games that feel very Nintendo just so they can be added to Smash. Which seems to be what happened with the fighty arms boxing thing? Was it just called Arms? People were super excited about that back with the Switch unveiling video and seeing that TwinCheeks character, and since then... nothing. Splatoon at least held strong as its own set of games even if it probably was made so they would have new Smash characters.

Splatoon had already proved its popularity back with the Wii U, Arms was a new thing and ended up never really taking off.

Plus Smash already has plenty of original characters (Master/crazy hand, Taboo, primids), it's actually a bit surprising neither were converted to playable status yet since usually it's a classic move to make the bosses playable for fighting games.

Someone made a Flash game where you play Mario levels with Samus, Simon etc., using their game mechanics. It's pretty good. I assume that seeing as Mario Bros was a "weird arcade platform brawler" and Super Mario Bros was the platformer, this is called Super Smash Bros. Wait they did that and it wasn't a platformer. Maybe they called it Super Smash World.

maglag wrote:There will be no more new Earthbound games besides Smash

Some people are still sore about that. I mean, there's a portion that just want an official translated release for the entire Mother series.

A lot of the franchises in Smash are already dead outside of Smash itself.

This is true, but I meant all of them. Including "the big ones" like Mario, Zelda and Pokemon.

Plus Smash already has plenty of original characters (Master/crazy hand, Taboo, primids), it's actually a bit surprising neither were converted to playable status yet since usually it's a classic move to make the bosses playable for fighting games.

I don't think the hand counts, as that's been a boss in I want to say every single Nintendo franchise since the games were carved into tablets by Zoroastrians. I'll grant the others on the basis of not knowing what they are and not caring enough to look them up.

Koumei wrote: I don't think the hand counts, as that's been a boss in I want to say every single Nintendo franchise since the games were carved into tablets by Zoroastrians.

Eyerok, Wallmaster... Oh gods you're right! Master and Crazy Hand have always been there under cunning disguises!

Smash Bros original bosses are Kirby dream world type villains

Does anyone else feel bored and disengaged by the number of franchises in games like Super Smash Bros. and Namco vs. Capcom?

Honestly, not really.

One thing I really like about BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle is they took some pretty random franchises like RWBY and put them into a good fighting game that was otherwise mostly ASW properties.

Yeah RWBY dropping into that was kinda an oddball only in the sense that it was not an Atlus game series. The RWBY universe would actually lend itself really well to a balls out Guilty Gear style fighting game. Or even a dynasty warriors style game with some production rather than the unity game thats out there now which still feels like a one man project sans the voices.

I guess RWBY just has a solid Japanese fanbase which is kind of cool. I'm not really a BlazBlue guy but I'd pick up BBTAG.

I loved the first few BlazBlue games for the characters, storyline and silly little "Teach Me, Boobie-Lady" and "Help Me, Professor Kokonoe" things. Oh right also it's a pretty good fighting game too.