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OgreBattle
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2016 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Watching Hillary's most expensive presidential campaign in American history explode via Trump's faith in the Force was the most engrossing Star Wars reboot I've ever seen. Now it's time for the Return of the Conservatives ushering back an age of hokey religion and ancient weapons to America.
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2016 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Koumei wrote:
Well a lot of the people who voted for him are the kinds of people generally fucked by Republicans - he rode a populist wave on the backs of lower and working class people, often without too much of an education or income. And now they're going to be standing there confused about why they suddenly have no money despite their hero getting in.

And then the news will tell them it's because of Democrats in congress and they'll accept that as fact, because it looks like intelligence and awareness are not learnable skills.


Trump got less votes than Romney with almost total overlap.

These idiots have been voting for the Republicans that fuck them their entire lives, and then being surprised when thy get fucked their entire lives, then blaming Democrats for it their entire lives.

This is the world most of us were born in.
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phlapjackage
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kaelik wrote:
These idiots have been voting for the Republicans that fuck them their entire lives, and then being surprised when thy get fucked their entire lives, then blaming Democrats for it their entire lives.

This is kinda a downside to a 2-party system, right? It's easy to always say it's the other guy's fault. That's why a 1-party system is so much better...*

*this message brought to you by the CPC
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Trump's transition team decided he needs a hispanic person in his cabinet. But all the good positions are given up, basically all that's left is Agriculture and Veteran's Affairs. So of course Trump narrowed it down to "Put a hispanic person in agriculture." because even when he's trying to hide his racism, he's just more racist.

But then it turns out that there are very few conservative hispanic people with experience in any way related to agriculture. So faced with choosing someone with experience or someone who was hispanic (for again, literally the thing that is a demeaning stereotype for hispanics) he is now willing to pick someone with fucking no experience at all, so long as they are hispanic.

This is the guy elected by all the white people who spent years complaining that Eric Holder was only hired to be AG because he was black and we should feel bad for all the more qualified white people that were passed up!
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Occluded Sun
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The best part of all this is that our elites consider releasing documentary evidence of conspiracy to control which party candidate was nominated to be a subversion of democracy.

In politics, committing crimes isn't a crime, only making people aware of them is.
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Occluded Sun wrote:
The best part of all this is that our elites consider releasing documentary evidence of conspiracy to control which party candidate was nominated to be a subversion of democracy.


Remember when that didn't happen, there is no evidence that it happened, and in this very thread I challenged the last dumbass who said that to show evidence or shut the fuck up, and then he mysteriously dropped the conversation hoping to bring it up when everyone forgets about how he has no evidence for his claim?

So your turn. If documentary evidence of a conspiracy to control which candidate was nominated, then surely you can provide this documentary evidence. And when you inevitably can't, surely as a reasonable person you will admit that you are wrong, and that there was no evidence of that, probably because it didn't happen.

Or you know, you'll disappear for 3 pages and come back and make the same false allegation you've already been proven wrong about in a different thread as soon as you think enough time has passed.

Spoiler Alert: Enough time has never passed. In reality, the more times you idiots prove you have no evidence for your allegations, the less likely people are to believe your stupid allegations without evidence the next time. This thread is already an example, since in this thread, someone asked for information from a real source because your Trumple butt buddy isn't trusted.

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Can I get this from someone who isn't slyjhonny?

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Mechalich
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kaelik wrote:
Trump's transition team decided he needs a hispanic person in his cabinet. But all the good positions are given up, basically all that's left is Agriculture and Veteran's Affairs. So of course Trump narrowed it down to "Put a hispanic person in agriculture." because even when he's trying to hide his racism, he's just more racist.

But then it turns out that there are very few conservative hispanic people with experience in any way related to agriculture. So faced with choosing someone with experience or someone who was hispanic (for again, literally the thing that is a demeaning stereotype for hispanics) he is now willing to pick someone with fucking no experience at all, so long as they are hispanic.


What's doubly annoying here is that while Agriculture isn't one of the sexier cabinet agencies it's one of the more important ones. Producing and distributing food is one of the few thinks that the USA is unmistakably good at. And the USDA is closely entwined with that process at pretty much every single level - the department actually has way more influence over the everyday lives of most Americans than Commerce, Labor, Treasury, and so forth. Also, food is one of the US's biggest exports, so USDA is going to be heavily involved in any major changes in trade policy (especially with Mexico, where agricultural products are a huge component of trade in both directions).

Secretary of Agriculture is the perfect job for a competent loyalist who likes the idea of being Secretary of X but doesn't crave the limelight (the current secretary, Tom Vilsack, former governor of Iowa, pretty much exemplifies the type). And there are plenty of Republicans who could do the job (either of the GOP senators from the Dakotas, who are both on the agriculture committee, for example) they just tend to be older white dudes.

This really shouldn't be hard, but Trump can't get around the idea that he's not running a mid-level media enterprise anymore.
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SlyJohnny
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

So this is happening.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-russia-cyber-idUSKBN14I1TY

Level and intelligent response from Priebus. Hopefully not even Trump would actually overrule a decision to eject foreign spies from the country. Unless you believe that republican officials were actively working with those same spies in order to steal the election, in which case... well, there's no helping you.

Can't help but wonder at the "other responses" Obama keeps menacing. I hope they're effective, but I can't help but imagine they won't be followed through, seeing as the republicans want everyone to stop focusing on this and just accept what's done as done and move on, and stop upsetting the president-elect by reminding him that a clever and maliciously-intentioned foreign power bet serious capital on him being the worst choice to lead the country.
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

1) Your entire argument is premised on the idea that Putin is a good trustworthy guy. Literally no part of that article says that Putin won't wait until January 19th and then assassinate people, and since you know, Putin famously assassinates political opponents, that isn't even out of character. Is there literally no depths to which you will not sink in defending Trump?

SlyJohnny wrote:
Unless you believe that republican officials were actively working with those same spies in order to steal the election, in which case... well, there's no helping you.


2) Yes, because it's not like several key people in Trump's transition team and cabinet don't have close ties with Putin and Russia. It's not like his SoS nominee specifically was engaged in illegal money laundering with Russia or anything.

This is what I'm talking about. Sure, it's certainly possible that Trump only publicly asked Putin to hack Clinton as a political stunt, and he only repeatedly referenced and used Russian material as a political tool, and he is only now fighting tooth and nail against investigation because he's an ego driven child who takes everything as a personal insult. Or maybe he's fighting tooth and nail against it because he doesn't know if someone in his team is involved, and he doesn't want to find out.

But maybe he's aggressively trying to shut down the investigation because he did have a deal or two, and if you think you can rule that out with certainty, then you are in fact, the delusional one.
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SlyJohnny
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kaelik wrote:
1) Your entire argument is premised on the idea that Putin is a good trustworthy guy. Literally no part of that article says that Putin won't wait until January 19th and then assassinate people, and since you know, Putin famously assassinates political opponents, that isn't even out of character. Is there literally no depths to which you will not sink in defending Trump?


You're making even less sense than usual. Who is Putin going to feed polonium to on January 19th, exactly? Why are you talking about assassination, and in reference to what? To accomplish what?

Do you just... have a brief stroke and then accuse a random person or an inanimate object of defending Trump every time you write a post, or something?
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

SlyJohnny wrote:
You're making even less sense than usual. Who is Putin going to feed polonium to on January 19th, exactly? Why are you talking about assassination, and in reference to what? To accomplish what?


..... how about the exact same US diplomats that he just promised not to expel? I mean look, in reality, there's no reason for him to do anything, because as of January 20th he has at best an incredibly incompetent president who will spend 4 years talking about how great Putin is literally no matter what Putin does because admitting that Putin is a bad guy would be a blow to his own ego. So he can jolly well just annex the Baltic States and get away with it, so he doesn't care about US diplomats.

But if Putin actually wanted to fucking retaliate, nothing about what he said prevents him from retaliating or is even a promise not to retaliate. So you posting an article so you can praise Putin and Priebus and talk about how great they are is you being a gormless idiot.

SlyJohnny wrote:
accuse a random person or an inanimate object of defending Trump every time you write a post, or something?


No, just you, because you keep defending trump in literally every post you make.
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SlyJohnny
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

So you just admitted that the scenario you proposed is basically ridiculous and won't happen? When it was literally only you that introduced it as a possibility anyway? And then you decided that I was 'supporting Trump" because I said "Not even Trump would be fucking stupid enough to do X", and also because a blood clot was forming in your brain?
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

SlyJohnny wrote:
So you just admitted that the scenario you proposed is basically ridiculous and won't happen? When it was literally only you that introduced it as a possibility anyway? And then you decided that I was 'supporting Trump" because I said "Not even Trump would be fucking stupid enough to do X", and also because a blood clot was forming in your brain?


Got I hate concern trolls even more than I hate actual fucking idiots. WHOLLY SHIT. I just now got that your name is literally lying dick, and you've been telling us you are a troll with every post.

LyingDick: HEY GUYS ISN'T PUTIN A GREAT GUY FOR DEESCALATING THIS SITUATION! I WANT TO SUCK HIS DICK BECAUSE HE'S SO RIGHT ABOUT EVERYTHING! ALSO I WANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT DUMBASS LIARS WHO LITERALLY MADE A CAREER OUT OF PROPAGANDA SURE ARE SAYING THE RIGHT THINGS THAT ASSURES ME THAT THE COUNTRY IS IN GOOD HANDS!

Me: Well except that Putin isn't doing that, because he's just making an empty promise with no weight as an opportunity to rub our noses in the fact that he's now supreme ruler of the US as well as Russia.

LyingDick: WELL I NEVER! WHY ARE YOU BRINGING UP PUTIN LIKE THIS HE MATTERS TO THIS CONVERSATION!
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DSMatticus
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

SlyJohnny, you are a pro-Trump concern troll. That is what you are. You talk about how a lot of stupid shit "concerns you," and that stupid shit is invariably 1) pro-Trump, and 2) almost always complete bullshit.

SlyJohnny wrote:
Level and intelligent response from Priebus. Hopefully not even Trump would actually overrule a decision to eject foreign spies from the country. Unless you believe that republican officials were actively working with those same spies in order to steal the election, in which case... well, there's no helping you.

I mean, let's take this one. There is a legitimate argument to be had about whether or not specific individuals were involved in, deliberately benefitted from, or unintentionally benefitted from the Russian interference in the election.

Trump, for example, publicly called for Russia to hack Clinton's email. Now, you don't take that seriously, because Trump is an idiot and you expect stupid noises to come out of his mouth, but that is a thing he did. He called on a foreign power to influence the election on his behalf; that's deliberate, and he benefitted from it. The Republican party apparatus denied being hacked - over top of our intelligence community's evidence to the contrary - for the purposes of denying that Russia's influence had been partisan. That's a lie they told the public in order to make Russia's leaks look more credible; that's deliberate, and they benefitted from it.

Paul Manafort, who both served as Trump's campaign advisor and also has ties to more mainstream Republicans like Bush 1.0 and Dole, also has ties to Yanukovych - pretty shady fucking ties that he was required to disclose under U.S. law and did not. I do not think Manafort is Russia's pet. I think he is a bunch of plutocrats' pet, and the plutocrats who own the Republican party simply have a lot of connections to the plutocrats who own Russia, and as such Paul Manafort ends up in both places at once. Which brings us to Rex Tillerson, who opposes sanctions on Russia because he is literally a businessman in Russia; Exxon has a deal with Rosneft for access to a bunch of Russian natural resources, and sanctions on Russia are money out of his pocket. Ladies and gentleman, meet Trump's Secretary of State. There's also Wilbur Ross, who helped put put some pro-Putin former KGB officers on the board of a European bank. That's Trump's Commerce Secretary.

Do I think Trump - or someone close to Trump - knew about the Russian hacking and that it was intended to elect Trump? Yes. Simply too many of the players involved have close personal ties to the oligarchy that is Russia. If you're the kind of person who does Putin a solid by planting former KGB officers onto a bank's board, then you are also the kind of person whose friendly gossip is the stuff that makes or breaks nations. Am I willing to start guessing names? Not really. There's inherently a random factor to shit like that, but when the individual odds are not low and you pack the cabinet with a who's-who of people who have sucked Putin's dick for a business deal, the probability that at least someone had some inside information about this approaches one awful fast.

Do I think basically every major Republican and Trump campaign member knew Russia was doing it, and wanted it to keep happening? Well, yes. Trump publicly said "hey, Russia, win this election for me." The Republican Party publicly lied in an effort to undermine claims that the hacking was partisan and thereby maximize the damage it dealt. These people aren't actually stupid, they're just desperate plutocrats who will do anything to run this country (into the ground). Trump wants to kill the investigation because he - like every other sane person on the planet - realizes it probably would implicate some scarily powerful people either on his team or in the broader realm of Republican lobbyists, and that would be really fucking bad for his plans to build an authoritarian regime. And it's entirely possible that it may even end up implicating him personally; he also has substantial ties to Russia.

But beyond that, let me walk you very slowly through your and Kaelik's exchange:

Putin: I'll decide if and how to retaliate once Trump is in office.

SlyJohnny: Wow! Look how reasonable everyone is being!

Kaelik: In what way is "I'll decide if and how to retaliate once the White House is packed full of corrupt pro-Russian plutocrats" reasonable or trustworthy? Putin could wait until Trump is in office and then murder a bunch of his political opponents (you know, like Putin do) because he's infinity times more likely to get away with it under Trump.

SlyJohnny: That's stupid! Who would he even murder?

Kaelik: Well, U.S. diplomats for starters, but that's not actually the point you fucking moron. The point is that you are praising Putin for promising not to retaliate until Trump is in office, which is exactly like praising someone for saying "I won't steal that diamond at least until it's the shift of the security guard I bribed." Nothing about the statement "I'm going to wait until I'm most likely to get away with asshattery and then decide whether or not to conduct my asshattery" precludes asshattery.

SlyJohnny: Ah-hah! So you admit he won't poison anyone!

DSM: Oh look, the idiot doesn't quite know how to read.


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Ancient History
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/12/singer-quits-mormon-tabernacle-choir-rather-than-sing-for-trump-i-could-never-throw-roses-to-hitler/
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Koumei
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

That's good for the one there who has principles, but it says something that the Mormons, who apparently are super-judgementalpious, are happy to sing for and endorse him. Just like how Utah was all too happy to vote for him because, despite his (many) failings, at least he's not a woman.

In this case though, it's not like turning him down means supporting someone else, they could have just gone "No, go fuck yourself" and continued to fight against demon armies apparently the Doom novels aren't historically accurate, nevermind.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I've had dreams like what's happening in politics right now.

On the plus side, NATO is taking the Good Guy stance.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I have some predictions for the Trump presidency that I want recorded for posterity:

That wall's not getting built. Sections of it might. They may fill gaps with chainlink fence but there will not be a wall that runs from the Pacific to the Gulf of Mexico.

Gay Marriage is not going away. It may become a political football but I don't think it's going away. Ditto with abortion.

There will be at least one "military adventure". It may be justified or not but the US will be dropping bombs during 2017-2020 that they weren't 2012-2016.

There will be arguments, protest and struggle. I don't see the status quo changing all that much.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Those were like the safest predictions ever. I'd like to add "A beloved celebrity will die" and "an airplane will fall, killing dozens" to this startling list.
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SlyJohnny
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

But of course he'll build the wall. Once he cuts off all immigrants from sending money back home, and Mexico is losing three times as much income as it'd cost to contribute towards the wall, then they'll see sense.

All that needs to happen is a massive never-ending government project to intercept or otherwise seize the assets of foreign nationals, and for no Mexican to just start using bitcoin or whatever.
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Omegonthesane
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

...I want to believe Lying Dick is being sarcastic here, but straight up referencing the "and make Mexico pay for it" bit of the plan as if it's viable combined with his earlier fellating of the Orange That Walks leaves me with little hope.
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Mechalich
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quote:
Once he cuts off all immigrants from sending money back home, and Mexico is losing three times as much income as it'd cost to contribute towards the wall, then they'll see sense.


I have never seen any proposal by anyone that addresses how to bar the transmission of remittances from one country to another (never mind US to Mexico) in a practical fashion, never mind in one that's actually legal or wouldn't have the big bank lobbies beating down doors in Congress. Immigrants manage to successfully remit money to their relatives in places like Somalia that don't have functional banking systems and to places like Syria where terrorists take a cut off pretty much every transaction and the efficacy of stopping either is close to zero. The idea that Trump can stop remittances to Mexico is insane.

As for building the wall, well, it's relatively easy to build chunks along private land or right-of-way zones where those approach the border, but a huge chunk of the southern border is occupied by protected state land, protected federal land (mostly national monuments and national parts), and tribal land. It's not completely impossible to build there, but it will take long and tiresome wrangling with Congress and an even longer (and more expensive) federal review process. The wall wold be a great business booster for people who write environmental impact statements in Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas.
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SlyJohnny
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Omegonthesane wrote:
...I want to believe Lying Dick is being sarcastic here, but straight up referencing the "and make Mexico pay for it" bit of the plan as if it's viable combined with his earlier fellating of the Orange That Walks leaves me with little hope.


I mean. The last sentence of my post was "...and for no Mexican to ever use bitcoin ever".

I'm sorry that your reading comprehension skills are so terrible and that you are so stupid, but this is as close as the spoon gets to your mouth.
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Pseudo Stupidity
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

SlyJohnny wrote:
Omegonthesane wrote:
...I want to believe Lying Dick is being sarcastic here, but straight up referencing the "and make Mexico pay for it" bit of the plan as if it's viable combined with his earlier fellating of the Orange That Walks leaves me with little hope.


I mean. The last sentence of my post was "...and for no Mexican to ever use bitcoin ever".

I'm sorry that your reading comprehension skills are so terrible and that you are so stupid, but this is as close as the spoon gets to your mouth.


Bitcoin is shit, and when you mentioned it as some sort of workaround I stopped being sure you were being sarcastic.
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DSMatticus
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

nockermensch wrote:
Those were like the safest predictions ever. I'd like to add "A beloved celebrity will die" and "an airplane will fall, killing dozens" to this startling list.

Really? Because some of them are obviously wrong.

Abortion is going away. Present tense, not future. There are these things called states and they pass laws which make it practically illegal to acquire abortions within their borders and the only check on that has been the Supreme Court - and they're doing a poor job of it even with Kennedy as the swing vote. By the time we're done with Trump, the swing vote will be Roberts or worse. Abortion is (probably) not going to be federally criminalized. I'm not comfortable predicting whether or not Roe v. Wade will be overturned, thereby throwing the decision back to individual states. But the process by which states de facto ban abortion by targeting clinics and closing them with highly specific regulations will not only continue, but accelerate.

As for whether or not the status quo is stable... well, that's kind of a really vague claim. If you include "black people having the practical right to vote," then the status quo is fucked. Jim Crow is coming back hard and is going to make 2016's bullshit look progressive, and a bunch of states, some of which are swing states, are going to get a further +1-2% R shift from what we've already seen. That's large enough to have drastic effects on the political map, and could possibly be the nail in the Democrats' coffin and turn them into a party that can really only play at the state level for a generation.

But the bigger question is whether or not we'll see a bunch of "corruption" investigations that target Trump's political opposition. He's still talking about draining the swamp, and he's still handing out questionnaires to various agencies that boil down to "rat on your liberal-minded friends so I can kick them out." This is the sort of stuff you see from a man who is about to arrest all of his political opposition. I'm not going to say "America is better than that," because we literally just proved we are not. But there are a lot of ways Trump could stumble or grow cold feet and accidentally spare our democracy long enough for him to lose power.


Last edited by DSMatticus on Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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