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Strung Nether
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 8:56 pm    Post subject: Board Games Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It seems that much of the discussion here is about the pen and paper, DM-adjudicated tabletop games. There seems to be a huge lack of discussion on some of the simpler(?), but growing in popularity board games such as Settlers of Catan or Descent 2ed.

Are these types of games not a focus of this forum?
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Prak
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Not generally, no, but there's no reason you can't start a thread.

I've played a good bit of Descent, and it handles dungeon crawling very well, but it lacks the world-interaction(/building) and (degree of) character customization that attracts me to RPGs.
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Schleiermacher
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Only to the extent that design lesson can be taken from them and applied to RPG design and development. This is first and foremost an RPG forum.
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Lokey
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Because lots of them are bad and come down to luck of the random elements. I'd be happy to discuss, but haven't played a huge number.

For the two games we played, I think there's interesting stuff in the Walking Dead Board game I played for example. Hear good things about Firefly, but never played it.

We've run Talisman a few times and there seems to be something there but it drags and people with more access to the spell deck dominate.
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Pixels
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Occasionally board games get some chatter, but it's rare compared to pen and paper roleplaying games. Is there something specific about them you wanted to ask or discuss?
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FrankTrollman
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I made a board game. It was an Arkham Horror mod based on Shadowrun in Los Angeles.









I could be persuaded to do that again some day. I have a lot of ideas on how things could be streamlined.

-Frank
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Strung Nether
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Pixels wrote:
Occasionally board games get some chatter, but it's rare compared to pen and paper roleplaying games. Is there something specific about them you wanted to ask or discuss?


Actually yes, and it applies to them in general.

As a new pseudo-adult, I have found that it is incredibly difficult to get a group of other adults (4 to 5) together, at the same time on a weekly or even bi-monthly basis. People have kids, jobs, visiting relatives, overtime, etc. getting in the way of the vastly more important issues of saving the princess and slaying the dragon. It also seems that many "traditional" RPG games can't really handle less-than-stellar attendance very well. To me, board games seem like a good solution to this problem. Some of them have just as much, if not more tactical complexity as a tabletop game (descent is a good example), and the rules seem to be much more tight and easy to use in general.

It seems like tradational RPG games are dying out, and board games are coming in force to replace them? I think the sales data supports this as well, but I'm not sure about that.
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Blicero
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I picked up Pandemic Legacy for Christmas, and I have played a bit of it so far. Quarterbacking issues aside, it seems like a pretty well-designed game. The Legacy components have not gotten super complicated yet, but I am interested in seeing where they go.
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Josh_Kablack
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'm avereraging 1.5 boardgaming nights ang 0.0 TTRPG sessions per week for the past coupla years, so I'm down for the sorts of discussions it's impossible to have on BGG.
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Tannhäuser
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I've been playing a bit of Ascension lately, which is interesting in that it's competitive, but you're not actively fighting the other players, just trying to acquire honor by defeating monsters. It reminds me slightly of Ninja Burger, which I quite enjoy. The art and lore, such that is there, are very decent I think.
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Leress
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I am playing Barbarian Prince, it's one of those single player board games and it's free:

http://dwarfstar.brainiac.com/ds_barbarianprince.html
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Koumei
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Apparently there's a new edition of Arkham Horror called Eldritch Horror. I played a game, picked out the Former Cultist again, and... I think we got some of the rules wrong (I at first assumed spending focus to re-roll meant you re-rolled your entire pool, not just one die), and fuck the "Three big missions per game", even one takes longer than your average RPG session. But overall it seemed simplified?

Descent is reasonably fun, I guess. If forced to play a board game I'd probably choose Descent or HeroQuest, but obviously I'm just wishing I could be playing an RPG at that point.
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TiaC
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Tannhäuser wrote:
I've been playing a bit of Ascension lately, which is interesting in that it's competitive, but you're not actively fighting the other players, just trying to acquire honor by defeating monsters. It reminds me slightly of Ninja Burger, which I quite enjoy. The art and lore, such that is there, are very decent I think.


I found deck thinning too powerful a mechanic. If you pick up some of the cheap cards that do this, you can improve your card quality much faster than simply buying cards.
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Zinegata
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Blicero wrote:
I picked up Pandemic Legacy for Christmas, and I have played a bit of it so far. Quarterbacking issues aside, it seems like a pretty well-designed game. The Legacy components have not gotten super complicated yet, but I am interested in seeing where they go.


No spoiler review from someone who has made it to December:

It deserves being the #1 game on BGG. It proves the Legacy system can work and may be a model for future board games that have multi-game "campaigns".

Which unfortunately kinda puts another nail in the coffin of traditional RPGs, where a big draw is the persistent campaign.

Quarterbacking is an issue certainly - but I think it's generally unavoidable in cooperative games anyway. But having a Legacy system for co-op proved MUCH better than the earlier implementation Risk Legacy, which was adversarial in nature, because players don't feel invested in fighting with each other over and over again/ By contrast a co-op legacy really cements a group into working as a team to beat the damn board.


Last edited by Zinegata on Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:57 am; edited 1 time in total
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Zinegata
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Lokey wrote:
Because lots of them are bad and come down to luck of the random elements. I'd be happy to discuss, but haven't played a huge number.

For the two games we played, I think there's interesting stuff in the Walking Dead Board game I played for example. Hear good things about Firefly, but never played it.

We've run Talisman a few times and there seems to be something there but it drags and people with more access to the spell deck dominate.


First, a general comment - yes, lots of boardgames are bad. This is what happens when the industry starts publishing 500 a year and you get more than 1 release per day. And on that note, - Please, please don't buy Firefly. You will regret it.

Indeed I have to say you seem to have an unfortunate list of so-so games there.

If you want a zombie game, Dead of Winter is probably the best one and comes closer to "Walking Dead" than the titular game. Talisman is also generally considered extremely dated. There are already quite a few games that seek to capture its feel but without the dicey randomness like Mage Knight.
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Zinegata
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Strung Nether wrote:
I think the sales data supports this as well, but I'm not sure about that.


Disclaimer: I've played 44 out of the top 50 games in BGG. So one can say I am a bit biased regarding the issue...

But I am friends with one of the owners of the biggest local importer of boardgames and RPGs in Metro Manila. And their importation is massively skewed towards boardgames now. Importing RPGs has almost gotten to the point of being an unprofitable chore.
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FrankTrollman
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Dead of Winter is a decently strong zombie co-op game. The "possible traitor" is unnecessary and the exile thing is too complicated, but the game is fast and fun without doing that. The hidden personal goal is plenty to keep quarterbacking to a minimum, and the different missions give the game a lot of replayability.

I will say that the events that happen each turn slow the game way down. I understand that they want them to catch you by surprise while you are doing other things, but it's clunky to have another player activate their trap card while you're doing stuff.

In any case, Dead of Winter is very much like a streamlined Arkham Horror. It has specific fixes for most of the problems Arkham has.

-Frank
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Kaelik
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The only Zobmie Board game I've played that didn't suck is Last Night on Earth. Way better than Walking Dead, although I haven't played Dead Winter.

Honestly though, just never buy a franchise tie in board game. There might be some that don't suck, but chances are really fucking slim. Franchise tie ins rely on the name to sell copies, non franchise tie ins rely on actually good experiences, so chances are much better that "unnamed space run around game" is going to be better than firefly.
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FrankTrollman
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Speaking of unnamed space run around games, you should play Galaxy Trucker. It has a phase where you make fun of how terrible the ship designs of the other players are.


Your ship sucks!

-Frank
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Koumei
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Is that literally the point of the phase, or is that just what ends up happening?
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angelfromanotherpin
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Koumei wrote:
Is that literally the point of the phase, or is that just what ends up happening?

Ship design is done under considerable time pressure, so people end up making mistakes. That phase is when you point out the mistakes they have made and remove the illegally placed pieces. Doing so insultingly is mandated.
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FrankTrollman
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Koumei wrote:
Is that literally the point of the phase, or is that just what ends up happening?


That is literally the point of the phase. You have a timed portion where you pipe dream yourself a ship, and then you have a mocking phase where the other players look your ship over for design flaws. Exposed conduits are a modest penalty, and mismatched conduits cause portions of your ship to fall off. And the other players are entitled and required to make fun of you when this happens.

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Koumei
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

That is the best thing ever. In all existence.
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Strung Nether
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

FrankTrollman wrote:
Speaking of unnamed space run around games, you should play Galaxy Trucker. It has a phase where you make fun of how terrible the ship designs of the other players are.


Your ship sucks!

-Frank


Seems like Battlestations. How is it? I found the rules in battlestations to be horribly 70s inspired, so did some minor re-writing.
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Zinegata
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Strung Nether wrote:
Seems like Battlestations. How is it? I found the rules in battlestations to be horribly 70s inspired, so did some minor re-writing.


It's completely different.

The premise of Galaxy Truckers is that you are (literally) insane space truckers. You are tasked to deliver ship components to some far away portion of the galaxy. The problem is that you don't have a ship, so you instead decided to use your pile of ship components to build your own ship. Like Lego, but only more retardedly hilarious.

I am not kidding about the premise. This is in the actual manual.

At the outset of each run you create a huge pile of facedown components. Players - with one hand literally tied behind their back - have to pick up components, look at it, and decide whether to add it to their ship or to throw it face up back to the pile. Each component provides various advantages - engines make the ship move, guns can fire on threats, crew compartments give you more (insane) crewmen etc - but it's worth noting that there are placement rules to consider. For instance you can't have your guns blocked by other ship components.

After the time limit (which can be even shortened by other players, if they actively want other players to suffer. This is highly recommended) the ships are then collectively sent through a series of obstacle course challenges. At this point you use your guns, shields, engines, and crew to try and resolve them. Some challenges will give out rewards that earn you more money. Others will just mess with you if you fail them. Enemy gun fire and asteroids may destroy ship components. If you are really unlucky you might see 95% of your ship blow up from one lucky hit and only your cockpit will skid to the finish line. The only consolation is that your fellow players generally cannot attempt to murder you too, as the obstacle course is usually cruel enough, but expansions can fix that "issue" for the bloodthirsty.

After the obstacle course comes the accounting. People get money for finishing ahead of others (due to more engines), and for goods/bonuses they collected. They also lose money for destroyed components - remember you were supposed to deliver them instead of using them for your own monstrous Lego space ship. And then you do this whole cycle two more times with the richest player in the end being the winner.

An iPad/Android version is already available and is immensely playable. When the game gets too easy expansions had been released which make the game even more sadistic (e.g. some components, when destroyed, now blow up and take the 8 surrounding tiles around them).

It is considered one of the Euro/Ameritrash era classics, and a big reason why Vlaada Chvatal (the designer) became one of the big names in the industry. It's one of his best games because he managed to take what are normally Euro-centric tight mechanics and made them so wacky and funny. We still believe he needs to die for bad design however for giving the world Bunny, Bunny, Moose, Moose.

TL;DR: You are Benny from the Lego Movie. Except you make retarded space ships and send them through a cruel obstacle course. For profit.


Last edited by Zinegata on Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:48 am; edited 9 times in total
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