Blades in the Dark

erik · Post by **erik** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:25 am

Not being an idiot is not silva's goal. Its goal is to get people to interact with it to rustle jimmies. There is zero chance of honest discourse with silva. You can either point and laugh or ignore it. Everything else is a road to frustration.

TheFlatline · Post by **TheFlatline** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:22 pm

Incidentally, I wasn't expecting followup contact from Bethesda so fast, but they contacted me yesterday, asked some follow-up questions, and then thanked me profusely and said that because of the nature of potential legal actions they couldn't comment any further on the subject.

So apparently someone thought it was important enough to wake Legal up on a Sunday to look into.

angelfromanotherpin · Post by **angelfromanotherpin** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:27 pm

Thanks for the update, the legal side is a deal more interesting than the actual game.

RelentlessImp · Post by **RelentlessImp** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:13 pm

Two weeks from now: KICKSTARTER: Our Legal Defense

Antariuk · Post by **Antariuk** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:36 pm

Yeah, after browsing the KS page I am very interested in how this plays out legal-wise because that author has definitely visited the Limbo-of-the-Lost-School-of-Game-Inspirations.

RelentlessImp wrote:Two weeks from now: KICKSTARTER: Our Legal Defense

Two weeks after that: "Lawyers in the Dark - Defend your favourite brand against the villainy of an entire internet."

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:51 pm

Hehehe.

Just got an awesome info from a very privileged source about the lawsuit. Its both relieving and totally ironic.

But I cant divulge, unfortunately.

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:57 pm

silva wrote:Hehehe.

Just got an awesome info from a very privileged source about the lawsuit. Its both relieving and totally ironic.

But I cant divulge, unfortunately.

Silva, a few days ago you were asking me where you can get a quickstart. Excuse me if I don't believe you have any info about the game or the legal processes.

angelfromanotherpin · Post by **angelfromanotherpin** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:59 pm

Oh man, so totally convincing that the dude who was literally confused about how to *look* at the game on Saturday has double-secret inside sources on Monday. Especially when said dude is an attention-whoring pathological liar.

Almaz · Post by **Almaz** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:05 pm

On one hand, inside sources are not very hard to get in the RPG industry.

On the other claw, silva's level of competence leaves me to believe it is beyond him even with the fabled "natural twenty."

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:07 pm

Longes wrote:
silva wrote:Hehehe.

Just got an awesome info from a very privileged source about the lawsuit. Its both relieving and totally ironic.

But I cant divulge, unfortunately.
Silva, a few days ago you were asking me where you can get a quickstart. Excuse me if I don't believe you have any info about the game or the legal processes.

Interesting how things can change after just one email, no ?

The miracles of internet.

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:58 pm

Silva, either back up your claim or shut the fuck up.

TheFlatline · Post by **TheFlatline** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:19 pm

Of course there's no lawsuit. And I didn't say there would be. I said that Bethesda's legal team was going to investigate, and that I, as a fan of Dishonored, was legitimately confused as to if this was licensed IP or not. I doubt that anyone has gone over anything in the last... 16 hours or so.

And even in my email I specifically said I was unfamiliar with IP law and that it might be totally legitimate. It didn't seem that way to me but I'm not a lawyer.

TheFlatline · Post by **TheFlatline** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:29 pm

Leress wrote:Silva, either back up your claim or shut the fuck up.

It's possible he's telling the truth. Not likely since I'm fairly certain that there'd be a period of investigation and then if that turns up dirt an official Cease & Desist well before there would be even the mention of a lawsuit.

I assume it's always possible that someone has gotten the blessing from Bethesda/Arkane too, in which case cool and game on. But I'd actually play that *up* in that situation, since it's a selling point.

But whatever. I'm done with the subject and moving on.

Stubbazubba · Post by **Stubbazubba** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:33 pm

There's no way anything has been decided as far as whether or not to file a claim this fast. Silva is blowing smoke, or at the very least his "source" is blowing smoke to reassure a backer.

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:50 pm

Can't reveal my source, no. Either believe me or dont. Whatever, really.

Going back to the game, some (potentially) interesting tidbits:

- the crew sheet, which the group creates collectively, and which "gains experience" the same way as a characters, as the crew ascends in the city´s underworld ladder. Also, the sheet defines what the main group activity is (stealing, smuggling, conning, cult-like endeavors, etc) and gives bonuses, obligations and goals according to it.

- each characters picks a vice at creation. Engaging in this vice during "downtime" is one of the ways to alleviate "stress" (a kind of damage) done during missions.

- the GM dont roll dice, only the players (yes! ). Except when generating random stuff based on tables or something.

And lastly: the author said there will be another round for those that came late to the project. He is still thinking how this will be, but he assured the it will happen.

nockermensch · Post by **nockermensch** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:56 pm

Kaelik wrote:Is this a language barrier? Is the Portuguese word for "industrial" a synonym for "absolutely not industrial in any way shape or form, and feature advanced technology invtented in real life by people in a time period that we currently call Before Comman Era"?

It may not surprise you that the Portuguese word for "Industrial" is "Industrial", meaning "exactly the same fucking thing it does in English". Silva seemingly decided that "industrial" works a synonym for "dark and oppressive", but that's his own fault.

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:01 pm

silva wrote:Can't reveal my source, no. Either believe me or dont. Whatever, really.

Going back to the game, some (potentially) interesting tidbits:

- the crew sheet, which the group creates collectively, and which "gains experience" the same way as a characters, as the crew ascends in the city´s underworld ladder. Also, the sheet defines what the main group activity is (stealing, smuggling, conning, cult-like endeavors, etc) and gives bonuses, obligations and goals according to it.

Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 3rd Edition did that 6 years ago. We can also count the Covenant from Ars Magica, though covenants are more complex.

RelentlessImp · Post by **RelentlessImp** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:06 pm

The whole vice thing reminds me of Natures from oWoD, too, for regaining Willpower.

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:06 pm

Cool. Whats your experience with "crew sheets" ? Liked, disliked ?

By the way: this may give a nice Shadowrun game.

Edit: and oh my, this is exactly what Ive been trying to do with Shadowrun right here.

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:38 pm

silva wrote:Cool. Whats your experience with "crew sheets" ? Liked, disliked ?

By the way: this may give a nice Shadowrun game.

Edit: and oh my, this is exactly what Ive been trying to do with Shadowrun right here.

Mildly liked. IMHO, the less discussion points the crew sheet has - the better. Each group decision adds a failure point where some people want to do A, some want to do B, and some want to go play Shadowrun. Example of bad "crew sheet" is the squad creation in Only War. The group needs to make 8 decisions, each of which is between 12 different options.

I'm still not convinced that BitD is a good game on its own. I don't feel like highly abstract games are rewarding enough to play crime-centric games, where loot is very important. In Shadowrun when we go to steal a giant mech, I get a giant mech in the end. In BitD I get monopoly money no matter what I do.

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:23 pm

Longes wrote:Mildly liked. IMHO, the less discussion points the crew sheet has - the better. Each group decision adds a failure point where some people want to do A, some want to do B, and some want to go play Shadowrun. Example of bad "crew sheet" is the squad creation in Only War. The group needs to make 8 decisions, each of which is between 12 different options.

Makes sense. I didnt take a good look on the Blades crew sheet yet, but judging from the "lightness" of the game, I suspect its options are fewer.

I'm still not convinced that BitD is a good game on its own. I don't feel like highly abstract games are rewarding enough to play crime-centric games, where loot is very important. In Shadowrun when we go to steal a giant mech, I get a giant mech in the end. In BitD I get monopoly money no matter what I do.

Are you sure about it in the specific case of Blades ? Coming from other similar abstract games, I never had this "monopoly money" problem.

*edit* just saw there is an "asset" concept for acquiring specific things that you want. And some classes have more advantages for aquiring assets, based on their special abilities. So I think we have the answer right there - there is the monopoly money ("coins") but there is also the giant mech ("assets").

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Apr 13, 2015 11:29 pm

Hey Longes, if you have the quickstart, please explain to me the "devil bargain" rule.

Oh, and: https://www.pinterest.com/onesevendesig ... -the-dark/ (cool

)

MGuy · Post by **MGuy** » Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:48 am

nockermensch wrote:
Kaelik wrote:Is this a language barrier? Is the Portuguese word for "industrial" a synonym for "absolutely not industrial in any way shape or form, and feature advanced technology invtented in real life by people in a time period that we currently call Before Comman Era"?
It may not surprise you that the Portuguese word for "Industrial" is "Industrial", meaning "exactly the same fucking thing it does in English". Silva seemingly decided that "industrial" works a synonym for "dark and oppressive", but that's his own fault.

I don't know why it would matter. silva's gonna keep on truckin' no matter what. It's not like there's any sense of pride or anything to go along with his actions. Call him an idiot all day as long as SOMEONE is responding to him he'll go home a successful troll.

silva · Post by **silva** » Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:56 am

MGuy, sorry but I dont get the point. Bloodborne features industrial age elements, as acknowledge by the very creator Miyazaki:

VG247 interview wrote:Bloodborne takes place in the city of Yharnam, which exists in a different era to Dark and Demon’s Souls, as made clear by all the Victorian architecture, steampunk elements and gunplay. When asked why he prompted a shift in time period, he explained, “There are several reasons, the first of which is the combat.

“We were already thinking of a shift to a combat system where you would enter battle more actively than the sword and shield-based combat of Demon’s. So we adopted the idea of guns, but there was a prerequisite that we didn’t want the game to turn into a shooting game, and the Victorian age fit perfectly. It’s an era where the imagery of old guns still remains.”

http://www.vg247.com/2014/06/12/bloodbo ... lains-why/

And this was one of the first results from google.

Now, if you dont see the victorian/industrial age elements in Bloodborne, well, thats your opinion and I totally respect. I just dont agree with it. And trying to force our opinions down each other throats well... lets just say I dont have 12 years old anymore.

*edit* in the very wikipedia article the game world is described as "Victorian Gothic".

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:21 am

silva wrote:MGuy, sorry but I dont get the point. Bloodborne features industrial age elements, as acknowledge by the very creator Miyazaki:

VG247 interview wrote:Bloodborne takes place in the city of Yharnam, which exists in a different era to Dark and Demon’s Souls, as made clear by all the Victorian architecture, steampunk elements and gunplay. When asked why he prompted a shift in time period, he explained, “There are several reasons, the first of which is the combat.

“We were already thinking of a shift to a combat system where you would enter battle more actively than the sword and shield-based combat of Demon’s. So we adopted the idea of guns, but there was a prerequisite that we didn’t want the game to turn into a shooting game, and the Victorian age fit perfectly. It’s an era where the imagery of old guns still remains.”

And this is why you should not get your information from interviews when you know literally nothing about the game. Anyone who actually played the game would know that there is nothing industrial anywhere in the entire fucking game, and that literally steam power is used zero fucking times, (and in fact, punk does have an actual meaning which doesn't fit bloodborne either) so the fact that a designer through out some buzzwords that don't mean anything is completely fucking pointless.

And the fact that he refers to Victorian architecture is both 1) not proof of anything fucking industrial, because those are different things. 2) Actually anti-industrial, in the sense that Victorian Architecture was a fundamentally backward looking rejection of the architecture spawned by the industrial revolution.

So where you can see the large square buildings of dunwall with rail lines, in bloodborne you see the ornamented, spired, architecture with no goddam metal visible anywhere.

silva wrote:Now, if you dont see the victorian/industrial age elements in Bloodborne, well, thats your opinion and I totally respect. I just dont agree with it. And trying to force our opinions down each other throats well... lets just say I dont have 12 years old anymore.

You don't see the victorian/industrial age elements in Bloodborne either, because there are zero fucking industrial age elements, and Victorian is counter industrial.

Also, I like how silva was trying to say that only 12 year olds try to convince other people they are correct, but what he actually said, is that he murdered his 12 year old son for disagreeing with him.

silva wrote:*edit* in the very wikipedia article the game world is described as "Victorian Gothic".

So the article described it as "notpunknotindustrial notindustrialnotpunk" and you think this supports your position? Or you just don't know what any of those words mean?

EDIT: As relates to the legal thing, Guys, do remember the silva has proven over and over again in the past that he lies about how distant he is from things that he shills, so even though there definitely isn't a lawsuit yet and he is totally wrong about that, it could be that he actual does have an inside source, because if someone told me that his friend was the kickstarter person and he was just lying about suddenly hearing about a cool thing in order to shill for his friend, I would only be able to say, "So just like every time he opens his mouth."