Princes of the City: Anyone Want to Bite?

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Ancient History
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Princes of the City: Anyone Want to Bite?

Post by Ancient History »

Doing the whole GURPS Illuminati OSSR has knocked around with some ideas I've had for a while with a game I'd like to try to run - if anyone wants in. But let me lay it out to you first.

The system and overall setting is old World of Darkness, specifically Vampire 3rd edition - I'm not against Classic World of Darkness or any of that, I just haven't bought any of the books.

When: The time is now, 2015. Maybe it's the Final Nights, maybe not, but Gehenna is not over the horizon, and all the metaplot is far and fucking away from where you are now.

Where: The place is Juneau, Alaska - a small city of around 30,000 people, accessible only by plane and boat; lots of tourist traffic, lots of lonely houses that keep to themselves. Long cold nights, but plenty of modern amenities, and nobody blinks if a frozen corpse that's been gnawed on by wild animals is found a few miles outside city limits. Not a bad place to be a vampire.

What: The name of the game is "Princes of the City" - and you, the player characters, are it. Not just the oldest vampires in the city, or the ones nominally in charge, but you are the only vampires in Juneau (not counting whatever childer you create), and the vamps from other towns and cities in Alaska and abroad recognize and respect your claim. You may be relatively newly established, but you're expected to maintain the Masquerade, and at least pay lip service to basic traditions like setting up an Elysium - and other than that, what you do is entirely your own business. Your city, your hunting grounds, your rules. For as long as you can hold it.

Who: The first part - before the game proper begins - involves character generation. This is a little more involved than your regular chargen for Vampire; you'll need to flesh out not just your personal abilities but some of the details of your unlives - where your haven is, what your resources and backgrounds are, what your influence is in the city and what systems you've set up to establish yourselves. So we're not just looking at you the vampire, but also your organization - allies, retainers, ghouls, etc. - and you'll probably want to collaborate with the other player characters to ensure a good spread of influence, and whatever internal pecking order or titles you choose. I'll help out with suggestions, rulings, prompts and the like, but I really want the players to work together to build the setting for the game.

I'll provide a pool of extra points at character creation to help fill out backgrounds et al. as necessary, and adjudicate rules issues as they come up - players from my other games know that I tend to be autocratic, but I prefer to bow to the will of the group - if there's a dispute or request on the rules (like, say, someone absolutely insists on playing a nWoD bloodline complete with their signature discipline) - we take a vote, and the majority rules. I strive for fairness, and above all I want people to have fun.

Why: For the second part - once the setting and organization is established, and the players have their characters filled out, their positions sorted - the in-character portion of the game begins. A rock thrown into the pond, basically; a test of how well the players have built their organizational structure, and how well they respond when something or someone challenges them. And that's the other half of the game; while there are some big bad Methusalahs off in other cities that will send their ex-special forces ghouls and blood-bound assassins to clean up you - and your mess - if the Masquerade is grossly breached, for the most part you are on your own, away from the traditions and sectarian conflict of clans and caitiff, Camarilla and Sabbat. The only ones that you have to answer to - or depend on - are each other.

Our Players
Suzanne Grant, 8th Generation Lasombra (Angellis Ater) [Koumei]
Ceallach "Kel" MacCoinnich, 9th Generation Gangrel [Prak]
Maximo Altamirano/Matlal, 8th Generation Follower of Set (Tlacique) [Whipstitch]
Constantin Szantovich, 8th Generation Toreador (ne Zantosa) [Nebuchadnezzar]
Vergil "Verge" Caldwell, 13th Generation Caitiff [hyzmarca]
Seth Simmons, 8th Generation Tremere [radthemad4]
Kenneth "Ia" Ranalli, 8th Generation Tremere [Shady314]

Group Backgrounds
Last edited by Ancient History on Thu Mar 19, 2015 9:54 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Post by Koumei »

I like the sound of this. I guess I have a question though: as it's not a D&D run-and-stab, is it likely to move a bit slower such that if I do something drastic like going to bed, I won't have over a page of posts on which to catch up?

If my unAmerican schedule can fit with this, then yeah, I'm all for it. Playing Vampire with Denizens sounds a lot better than playing it with the usual people, who felt that the original was perfect, if not for "just a few issues with the rules like Potence, Celerity and Fortitude being broken must-haves".
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Post by Ancient History »

If my last game is anything to go by, I suspect posting will start out regular and then taper off to once-a-day or once-every-two-days. I won't promise there is no stabbing, but all stabbing will be abstracted in the build-up portion (you are assumed to have survived to build your power base).
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Post by Koumei »

In that case, count me in.
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Post by SlyJohnny »

I'm interested! Not played much WoD before though. Like one game as mortals, and that videogame.

I'm thinking a Tremere who agreed to this plan because he wants somewhere quiet and secure to study without having to get embroiled in politics and complications and other distractions. With the OOC hope that complications and distractions will be in plentiful supply.
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Post by Koumei »

Having trawled across some of Juneau in Google Maps, it actually looks like a fairly manageable city, a lot less built up than many. I'm toying with ideas, but as it stands, I'd like to pursue one of the following:
*Running some of the nightclubs (because drunks are easy, oh snap, a daterape reference!), using that as a source of food and of information, keeping an ear out on those lower classes. Probably Lasombra Antitribu. Specifically stays out in this place because of the rarity of vampires in the area, and the lack of having to deal with the usual bullshit, theoretically able to rule in peace. (Obviously things will not work out so easily)

*Running the department of environmental protections, ordering the coast guard around in their icebreakers to really crack down on companies dumping stuff in the ocean, coming across as a real greenie. And totally not as a way of having some input into the government while also making life difficult for rival companies to those that I own, no way. Isolated area means being able to get away with more stuff on the mortal side of things, and also if it's far North enough that they have the weird daylight thing going on, that can explain someone keeping odd hours. Probably a Ventrue.
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Post by radthemad4 »

I've enjoyed the parts of Bloodlines that I've played, but that's the extent of my Vampire knowledge. Still, I feel that an available game is the best excuse to learn a new system. Count me in as a low priority extra if there's room for one more when you're planning to start.

Is the 3rd edition the 1998 Revised edition? What splats and other sources are allowed (so far)?
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Post by Ancient History »

radthemad4 wrote:Is the 3rd edition the 1998 Revised edition?
Yes.
What splats and other sources are allowed (so far)?
I'm fairly open on what material you want to pull in from different splats - not all the Dark Ages material would be relevant, of course, but I'm sure we can make things work.
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Post by Ancient History »

To expand a bit on what I said, a large part of the player's influence will be reflected in their background traits - reflecting a character's wealth, allies, retainers, access to easy feeding, etc. What I'd like to see is characters going beyond the normal "I have five dots in Contacts" sort of thing - I'd like to see the contacts fleshed out as far as who they are, where they're placed in society, how they interact with the character, their importance to the overarching organization, etc. Given the characters' relative status (princes of the city), I'm thinking of waving the normal cap on how high background can go, and even allowing the elder backgrounds from Elysium (minus Elder generation).

Beyond the sheer numbers, I'd like to see players develop the actual organization - where their havens are, where Elysium is, what the rules are in their city (and how they enforce them), how they plan to manage the Masquerade (and breeches thereof), any unique ideas and provisions that go beyond the dot ratings - like keeping a cache of anti-vampire weapons in X's haven, or getting a specific type of blackmail material on Y non-player character, that kind of thing.
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Post by Koumei »

Yeah, I have ideas for various people and places and everything. I just don't want to go full-tilt into fleshing stuff out before anything is confirmed. But wandering around in Google Maps was actually to make note of specific locations.
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Post by SlyJohnny »

Oooh. Juneau has a campus for the University of Alaska. I figure my Tremere runs that place now. Or possibly only essentially runs it, if being a chancellor of a university involves too many Skype meetings and such.

If Koumei is also going with a "fled here to rule in peace" riff, maybe that can be our group's theme. A group that's looking to hold onto their little fiefdom rather than forge a new empire. It suggests a sort of world-weary, pragmatic approach to problem solving, where we ruthlessly destroy troublemakers for threatening our peace and quiet.
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Post by radthemad4 »

SlyJohnny wrote:If Koumei is also going with a "fled here to rule in peace" riff, maybe that can be our group's theme. A group that's looking to hold onto their little fiefdom rather than forge a new empire. It suggests a sort of world-weary, pragmatic approach to problem solving, where we ruthlessly destroy troublemakers for threatening our peace and quiet.
Yeah, that sounds great. I skimmed some fluff in tvtropes and 1d4chan, and am currently reading Gurps: Vampire: the Masquerade alongside AH's OSSR. Currently thinking of making sort of beastmaster who uses the eyes and ears of rats, birds, insects, etc. to keep tabs on the city (and probably work in Koumei's department of environmental protection if she goes with that). Also,
Juneau Wildlife Viewing Guide wrote:All of Juneau is bear country
Is it possible to make a decent character with a schtick like this?

How much time do we have before we start?
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Post by Ancient History »

It's not impossible, if you hunt out the right powers. I don't have a date set for starting the game yet, just sort of feeling people out right now.
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Post by Koumei »

So if we're going for this "Fleeing to our own quiet fiefdom" angle, it probably makes sense for us to not only have an array of contacts, but basically have a spy network running everywhere - just for word of anything invading.

We'd probably want annoying bureaucratic laws in place regarding visiting vampires (as in "you must send a request at least seven days prior"). Treating them like they're out on bail/registered sex offenders probably won't fly, but requiring they let us know what they're up to should be fine.

If we have enough of a government influence, we can actually back this up. Because really, the way to rule over the herd is to actually rule over them in a way that they all recognise. That will also allow us to label a supernatural menace as actually being an escaped serial killer or something and mobilise SWAT against them.

At either rate, we probably do want to either all be part of the government so we can actually just have a state-funded place as our Elysium and people won't even ask questions about us meeting up in relative secrecy there, or to all be the board members of some bullshit company that exists entirely as a cover for our secret board meetings.
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Post by Reynard »

Somewhat interested. Need to brush up on my cWoD (and commit myself to checking forum every day).


Koumei:
> we probably do want to either all be part of the government
It's not Barrow (2 month long day, IIRC), but summer nights will be pretty short. It would be really hard to explain why you work from 23.00 till 03.00.

Some sort of Special Sub-Committee of Alaskan Civil Service Department might work out. But mayor or police chief would have to get very creative.

Police psychologist with Dominate would be more appropriate, for example.
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Post by Ancient History »

radthemad4 wrote:Currently thinking of making sort of beastmaster who uses the eyes and ears of rats, birds, insects, etc. to keep tabs on the city (and probably work in Koumei's department of environmental protection if she goes with that). Is it possible to make a decent character with a schtick like this?
I looked it up, and there's a combo discipline power called Reads the Winds (Animalism 4/Auspex 5) which lets you see through the eyes of all the surrounding animals. Which is a good point to talk about combo disciplines!

These are powers outside the normal power tracks, which often have as their prerequisites some combination of disciplines of various levels; these powers are supposed to be "rare" and so are costly, but you guys are allowed (and even expected) to have your little tricks. So if you want a combo power, the equivalent cost in Freebie points is 1/3 the listed XP cost. So Read the Winds (20 XP) would be 7 Freebie Points at chargen.
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Post by Koumei »

Reynard wrote: It's not Barrow (2 month long day, IIRC), but summer nights will be pretty short. It would be really hard to explain why you work from 23.00 till 03.00.
Probably best to go corporate then. Besides, corporations outrank governments, last I checked :/

We could still put some ghouls or dominated human thralls in the local council or whatever, though.
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Post by Prak »

Damnit, I was so in and already thinking about a gangrel hermit type who has ghouled hunters and beasts to make the wilds around the city even more perilous, possible a ghouled werewolf or something too. Then Rad mentioned a beastmaster sort of character.

Thinking about it--Rad, if you were thinking of a more city focused beastmaster, that could work out, with you handling whatever animals are in the city, and my character being more focused on the outer wilderness. You're more spy animal oriented and I'm more "good luck getting past ghouled bears, fucknuts."

Edit: any "people jobs" are probably best handled by extremely loyal ghouls, using the sort of "small core with direct control over a few things and a lot more indirect control" idea that is mentioned in the Illuminati review.
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Post by Koumei »

So yeah, unless A_H has a problem with antitrubu, I'll do the Lasombra thing. Because I'm more familiar with those, I even used to have their Clanbook, and they embody the sexy-vampire-chick image. I haven't even looked at a sheet yet because I don't know what rules and stuff are going to be in place for character generation. Not even sure if we're supposed to be generally powerful, or just that we're supposed to be tricky and well-connected and set up with lots of links.

We should probably set down some actual rules (in character), as an agreement between us (that anybody visiting suddenly has to adhere to without being part of the initial agreement). Specifically regarding the creation of new vampires, numbers of ghouls, and so on. Proper bureaucracy.
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Post by Ancient History »

I don't care what clan or bloodline you are. I don't care if it's extinct in the Modern Nights, you can be the last one for all I care.
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Post by radthemad4 »

Ancient History wrote:I looked it up, and there's a combo discipline power called Reads the Winds (Animalism 4/Auspex 5) which lets you see through the eyes of all the surrounding animals.
Awesome! Thanks.
Prak wrote:Thinking about it--Rad, if you were thinking of a more city focused beastmaster, that could work out, with you handling whatever animals are in the city, and my character being more focused on the outer wilderness. You're more spy animal oriented and I'm more "good luck getting past ghouled bears, fucknuts."
Yeah, that works for me.

I still have a lot more reading to do, especially the actual system followed by splatbook diving.
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Post by Whipstitch »

I'm interested. I'm better with games about scheming and such than I am with dungeon crawls, so I suspect I could easily outdo my dismal performance in the Conan game. I'm still sorry about that, btw.

My main concern is that I suspect adapting After Sundown to oWoD fluff would be less confusing in many ways than trying to line item veto Vampire splats and Generation rules into something remotely approaching fairness. I mean, seriously, the number of Tremere secret societies and Blood Magic paths is so bloated that you could seriously eliminate every clan but the Tremere from the game and still have enough powers and antagonist factions to choose from.
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Post by Koumei »

A_H: groovy. In that case... how evil/derpysatanic are the "satanic" ones? Specifically, the Lasombra minor bloodline of Angellis Ater. I like the idea of revitalising evil with a new modern image that resonates with the youth of the day, "corporate evil", and just the first two dots of Daimoinon seem really useful. It can work well with keeping a bunch of nightclubs as havens/feeding grounds, and also being a soul-sucking businesswoman.

But if they all have to personally follow Satanism-as-understood-by-White-Wolf, or any Satanism really, then it could get mind numbingly stupid. Similarly, if they have to be evil in a stupid kind of way, then that's just disruptive to the group and I don't want to do that and will just go regular Lasombra.
Whipstitch wrote: My main concern is that I suspect adapting After Sundown to oWoD fluff would be less confusing in many ways than trying to line item veto Vampire splats and Generation rules into something remotely approaching fairness.
Possibly, but I imagine A_H wants to get full mileage out of products he owns and with which he is familiar. For me, I'd have to learn the new system because I never actually got around to sitting down and learning the rules of AS due to "I'll never get a chance to actually play this".
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Post by Ancient History »

I'm going to admit I haven't read all of After Sundown either. Power balance isn't really an issue for this game either, so don't worry your heads on that score.

Re: derpysatanism - You are not bound by whatever fluff that White Wolf & co. have published. From what you've described it sounds like you've got a solid concept. If you decide you need to take a demon as one of your contacts so you have an ear to the ground in the courts of Hell or something, we'll talk.
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Post by Ancient History »

Also, there's a brief rundown of the six Traditions here: http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Traditions_(VTM) - you don't have to abide by these strictly in your city, but it's what visiting vamps will be familiar with and expect, more or less.
Last edited by Ancient History on Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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