New to Shadowrun, would like some pointers on chargen

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Thu Oct 28, 2010 6:27 am

Echoes wrote:Y'know, I realized something. I had Infinity Mirror completely wrong. I thought Agent Smith was Infinity Mirror. This is what happens when I don't read Frank's explanation of things and try to figure out what the rules say.

Still works, I was just responding to the argument against Infinity Mirror with Agent Smith.

Yeah, Agent Smith is a different and huge problem. What's double amusing is how they tried to patch Agent Smith out of the game and failed in Unwired. And in doing that, they made Drop Out like a gajillion times worse than it was. Here were the "nerfs" to Agent Smith:

Each Persona is allowed 1 (one) Agent to be rolled on it that gets to take actions as the Persona with the Persona's Access ID. Any Agent after the 1 per Persona uses the Agent's own Access ID.
Copies of the same Agent have the same Access ID unless and until you change them to have a different one with programming or spoofing.
Nodes can lock out any Access IDs they want without rolling dice, and can be set to automagically add any Access ID that is being used by more than one thing (such as two or more extra agents) to the list of Access IDs o lock out.

Finished!

Oh... wait. No.

Where does that fail? Like, everywhere. The first place it fails is the basic idea that holding someone to no more than 2 Agents (unless they do some software tests or pay some more money to have more than one Access ID in which case they get more) is a meaningful restriction. It's really not. The second place it fails is that there are actually a lot of useful things that agents can be doing without actually logging on to anything. Driving up alerts, using Medic on damaged systems, laying in wait on your nodes to gangster stab enemies, and so on. Indeed, since your own machines can still hold as many copies of your own agents as you want, the entire escapade did not address Agent Smith at all from the Defender's side. Renraku can still intercept you with 100 copies of the same agent, because blocking out their own Agent Smiths from their own nodes is still merely an option.

But the really damning part is that Agents count as running programs anyway, as do their running programs (probably, this is one part of the rules which is genuinely unclear, because it is flat contradictory about whether an Agent's Attack program counts against the Agent's System, or the Persona's System, or both). So if you intended to run more than one Agent you'd probably want to distribute the load onto multiple pieces of hardware. And get this: you are entitled to 1 (one) Persona for every piece of hardware. If you have 100 pieces of hardware running 100 copies of the same Agent, you are actually entitled to hackastack 100 separate Personas, and then "you" haven't violated the "1 extra Agent" rule. You haven't eve used your 1 extra Agent, every copy is still the "first" on each Persona.

-Username17

Neurosis · Post by **Neurosis** » Thu Oct 28, 2010 6:31 pm

Isn't it expensive to buy enough commlinks to run an arbitrarily high number of Agents at above Rating Shit? Because the System rating of the commlink limits the rating of programs that can be run on it.

Orca · Post by **Orca** » Fri Oct 29, 2010 4:01 am

There are street sams worth absurd amounts. Or, in RL, companies will spend up large on server hardware. 'It would cost a million dollars' is an argument that a corner store won't have it, but it says nothing about what a company with a few hundred employees will do. To say nothing of large companies or megacorps ...

Archmage · Post by **Archmage** » Mon Nov 01, 2010 7:11 pm

A street sam or mage is totally going to be willing to shell out 160k for a low-essence synaptic booster to get an additional 2 IPs a combat turn. A hacker can buy a lot of commlinks for 160k and get a lot more than two extra actions a combat turn. Should be pretty obvious.

Even cheap shit like wired reflexes costs enough to buy a half-dozen commlinks or whatever.

Zeezy · Post by **Zeezy** » Mon Oct 31, 2011 8:53 pm

I thought this campaign was dead in the water until a couple months ago, which is why I haven't given much of an update. The MC told me he was still interested in running the campaign, and since interest picked up again semi-recently, the campaign got revived and will actually start up soon. I managed to convince him to use the House Rules de Santa Cruz (and The Ends of the Matrix -- thank goodness for that; given what I've read in this thread alone, the standard Matrix rules are a goddamn clusterfuck), so I had to retool my character to accommodate the skill discounts and reverting SR4A's stealth nerf of skill groups. I managed to make some face/street sam hybrid, but I don't know how well I did with what I have, which is why I'm here right now. Current character sheet is in the spoiler.

Metatype: Elf (25 BP)

Attributes: 280 BP
Bod: 5/6 (5) | Wil: 3/6 (3)
Agi: 6/7 (6) | Log: 4/6 (4)
Rea: 5/6 (7) | Int: 4/6 (4)
Str: 2/6 (2) | Cha: 7/8 (7)
Init: 9 (11) | Passes: 1 (3)
Edge: 4/6 | Ess: 3.65

Thoughts: I'm not sure how often our MC will refresh edge, so I erred on the safe side with 4 points. My only qualm with this attribute spread is the 2 in strength, but I should manage so long as I'm in my power armor. I don't think Strength is worth losing sleep over, but correct me if I'm wrong.

Active Skills: 124 BP
4 Group: Biotech

4 Group: Influence
>6 Negotiation (Bargaining +2)
>4 Con (Fast Talk +2)

4 Group: Stealth

1 Group: Athletics
>4 Gymnastics (Breakfall +2)

4 Longarms (Sniper Rifles +2)
4 Blades (Swords +2)
2 Unarmed Combat (Parrying +2)

4 Perception (Hearing +2)
4 Survival
1 Armorer (Firearms +2)
1 Artisan (Singing +2)

Thoughts: With the Orientation System, I'm not sure whether I should invest a point in Navigation so I stop defaulting -- I'm rolling 5 dice, but I don't know if I want or need 7. I'd probably drop a point from Survival to grab it.

Knowledge Skills: 24 free points, 3 BP
3 Corporate Politics (Street)
3 Psychology (Academic
3 Renraku (Street)
3 Biology (Academic)
2 Club Music (Karaoke +2) (Interest)
2 Fashion (Casual Wear +2) (Interest)

Languages:
N (N) English
2 (2) American Sign Language
3 (3) Japanese
4 (4) Sperethiel

Positive Qualities: 35 BP
Perceptive (2) (10 BP)
First Impression (5 BP)
Magic Resistance (2) (10 BP)
Martial Arts (Krav Maga: Take Aim) (5 BP)
Restricted Gear (5 BP)

Thoughts: I am actually tempted to take Latent Awakening, but I'm unsure if that's a good idea. The MC already effectively banned awakened characters at chargen with his "awakened metahumans have their heads explode on Pandora" thing (I'm not about to risk seeing if a cyberzombie's background count overrides Pandora's anti-mage field), but he also said that a latent Awakened might have a chance of not exploding. Barring all that, if I did awaken, Adept would obviously be the best deal for me. Anything else would likely just be a waste of BP. I don't feel right playing roulette like that, although I mildly trust my MC to not dick my character over royally without letting me have a say in the matter.

Negative Qualities: -35 BP
Allergy: Common, Mild (Latex) (-10 BP)
High-Maintenance Implant (Cyberears) (-5 BP)
Prejudiced: Common, Biased (Uncommon metatypes) (-10 BP)
Scorched (-5 BP)
Poor Self Control: Thrill Seeker (-5 BP)

Thoughts: I feel only mildly guilty about taking Prejudiced. It's decent character flavor, although a Composure (0) Test seems insulting, especially since my odds of rolling a critical glitch are extremely low (about 0.2%, if my math's right). The high-maintenance implant is neat flavor and a good reason for my character to stop buying used 'ware. I just need to figure out a believable way for my character to service the implant herself. Maybe a tripod-mounted camera or something. Also, a question: how much of a death sentence is Thrill Seeker? Looking at it now, making a Composure (2) Test to avoid jumping into a dangerous situation seems like a bad idea, although the MC might make exceptions for obvious death traps -- in my mind at least, there's a difference between "risky" (taking on three guys at once) and "suicidal" (taking on three dragons at once).

Contacts: 18 BP
L2/C4 Fixer
L2/C2 Street Doctor
L6/C2 Hacker

Resources: 50 BP (250,000)

Code: Select all

182,925&#58; Ware
------------------------------------------------
  1,000&#58; Datajack &#40;x2&#41; &#40;-0.2 Ess&#41;
160,000&#58; Synaptic Booster R2 &#40;-0.5 Ess&#41;
    650&#58; Internal Air Tank &#40;-0.25 Ess&#41;
 10,000&#58; Synthacardium R2 &#40;Used&#41; &#40;-0.12 Ess&#41;
  1,250&#58; Orientation System &#40;-0.2 Ess&#41;
    750&#58; Cybereyes R4 &#40;Used&#41; &#40;-0.6 Ess&#41;
>   375&#58; Flare Compensation
>   500&#58; Low-Light Vision
>   500&#58; Thermographic Vision
>   500&#58; Smartlink
> 2,250&#58; Vision Enhancement R3
>   500&#58; Vision Magnification
>    50&#58; Protective Covers
>    50&#58; Skinlink
    500&#58; Cyberears R3 &#40;Used&#41; &#40;-0.48 Ess&#41;
>   375&#58; Damper
> 2,250&#58; Audio Enhancer R3
> 1,000&#58; Select Sound Filter R2
>   375&#58; Spatial Recognizer
>    50&#58; Skinlink

 58,300&#58; Weapons & Armor
------------------------------------------------
     50&#58; Survival Knife
  2,500&#58; Nodachi
>   100&#58; Personalized Grip
> 1,000&#58; Chameleon Coating
  3,350&#58; Ares Desert Strike
>   400&#58; Smartgun System &#40;external, underbarrel&#41;
>>1,000&#58; Ultrasound System
>>  100&#58; Vision Magnification
> 1,000&#58; Chameleon Coating
>   400&#58; Silencer
>    50&#58; Skinlink
>   280&#58; EX-Ex Rounds x28
>    20&#58; Spare Clips x4
 12,000&#58; Light Military Armor
>   600&#58; Fire Resistance R6
>   900&#58; Insulation R6
> 1,200&#58; Nonconductivity R6
> 5,000&#58; Chemical Seal
> 4,500&#58; Strength Upgrade III
>10,000&#58; Military Helmet
>    50&#58; Skinlink
  8,000&#58; Chameleon Suit
>   600&#58; Fire Resistance R6
>   900&#58; Insulation R6
> 1,200&#58; Nonconductivity R6
> 3,000&#58; Thermal Damping R6
>   100&#58; Helmet

  5,675&#58; Other Gear
------------------------------------------------
  1,600&#58; Commlink &#40;Response 2, System 3, Firewall 4, Signal 3&#41;
> 1,000&#58; Redundant Biofeedback Filter R2
>    50&#58; Subvocal Microphone
>    50&#58; Skinlink
    600&#58; Medkit R6
     25&#58; Flashlight
    140&#58; Thermal Smoke Grenades &#40;x4&#41;
    210&#58; Frag Grenades &#40;x6&#41;
    180&#58; Flash-Bang Grenades &#40;x6&#41;
  1,200&#58; Stim Patches R6 &#40;x8&#41;
    100&#58; Sim Module
    100&#58; Virtual Pet
    250&#58; Virtual Surround Music
    170&#58; Clothing

  2,000&#58; Low Lifestyle &#40;1 mo, waiting for me back on Earth&#41;

Thoughts: The internal air tank is a lifeline in case my exopack (our means of breathing on Pandora, which every character gets for free) fails. Breathing hydrogen sulfide is generally bad for a metahuman's health. While a katana is iconic for street samurai, the nodachi is apparently a thing in Arsenal, which makes me sad. Is there any downside to it, aside from the higher cost and being exceedingly difficult to conceal?

1100 Nuyen left over. Suggestions?

One more thing. When making the Extended Test to buy goods, what determines the availability interval: the price per unit, or the total sum of what you're buying? For instance, let's say I'm looking for 20 rounds of APDS ammo. It's 70 nuyen per 10, but overall the price is 140. What's the interval: 12 hours or a day?

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:26 am

One more thing. When making the Extended Test to buy goods, what determines the availability interval: the price per unit, or the total sum of what you're buying? For instance, let's say I'm looking for 20 rounds of APDS ammo. It's 70 nuyen per 10, but overall the price is 140. What's the interval: 12 hours or a day?

That's actually unclear. My personal rule is that if you are buying ten or less of something, you go by the unit value, and if you're buying more than that you go by the total value. Really large purchases are supposed to be difficult, but modest purchases are not.

-Username17