Embezzlement in Catalyst

[Fuchs]

Quote tags broken.

[Stahlseele]

Quote tags broken.

Sorry <.<;,
I fixed it.

[The Vigilante]

It really irks me to see the likes of Dr Funkenstein and Patrick Goodman blabbering on and on about how anyone who isn't 100% behind Bills and Coleman is a member of the "Cult of St Frank Trollman" and just want to "pour gasoline on the fire" and destroy Shadowrun and CGL.

They really can't seem to understand that people might be not too trusting of a company that's lost 80% of its core members in the blink of an eye amidst this "co-mingling of funds" affair ; and also that some people might be able to understand the fact that CGL/IMR =/= Shadowrun itself, that SR is a game and a brand that IS able to survive just about any and all company switch.

They also aren't able to wrap their head around the fact that the "quality SR products" CGL put out in the last years were the product of its employees and freelancers WHO JUST QUIT, and that just because the CGL logo is printed on future books won't magically make them as good as the old ones.

Frank, I know you've stated in the past that Ancient History isn't really handy around rules and numbers, but how valuable do you think he is as a fluff writer, compared to the ones they replaced him with ?

[Fuchs]

The real sad thing is that those people are supposed to write for a game that deals with corrupt corps and features the criminals who run against and for them.

If they "can't wrap their heads around" the fact that some people do not trust them, and even condemn them for working for Coleman and his cronies, then they should try to write about Shadowrunners in the first place.

[Clutch9800]

They know people don't trust them.

They know that people within and without are trying to destroy them.

Bear in mind that they took over these lines when no one else wanted them. Did they fuck the dog on this little fiasco? Hell yeah.

But do bear in mind that the lines themselves wouldn't have survived without these guys.

I honestly can't blame them for taking on a siege mentality. When folks really are out to get you, then paranoia is just common sense.

Hang in there.

Clutch

[Fuchs]

Of course not. It is very understandable - but it does not, in any way, not even a little bit, make the actions and inactions of the CGL management any less despiccable.

[The Vigilante]

Choice cuts :

I can. They want to see Loren Coleman lose control of the license, no matter what it takes, no matter where it goes.

Yeah, we're really the bad guys here, 'cause we wish bad things to happen to fraudsters...

Yeah. There are people violating their non-disclosure agreements, leaking items from the forums to people no longer in the freelance pool, and they're doing it deliberately and maliciously.

And Frank therefore felt the need to pour some more gasoline on the fire; apparently things weren't hot and bright enough.

Not that I'll ever be able to convince the Cult of St. Frank of the strangeness of their thought processes, but I find the fact that someone is doing something wrong (viloating their NDA contracts) in order to spread pandemonium...and Jason is being painted as the bad guy for trying to stem the leak...kind of funny, in a horribly morbid kind of way. I simply cannot wrap my head around the way they think.

Note that it's been established on Dumpshock that most freelancers didn't even have any NDAs to start with. The rest of the post speaks for itself.

So, I guess the question of what Ancient History actually meant has been fully stated.

Strangely, I am neither vexed by his response or pleased that my interpretation was correct. Only one word comes to mind...


h u b r i s

Jen, has already stated twice that Randall never asked her to cook the books.

Yes, asking to falsify royalty reports is certainly not "cooking the books"... Hair splitting much ?

And it's equally shocking that someone who is so pissy and bitter at the company that he bitches about getting paid would find a replacement for his work 'lacking.' Truly, utterly, and completely shocking.

What the fuck is this supposed to mean ? From what I understand, Ancien History quitting wasn't entirely about getting paid, but even then what's so fucking shocking about wanting to get paid for work you've done ?? This guy is a fucking turd sandwich.

Perhaps there are freelancers who believe that they have burned bridges so thoroughly that if CGL fixes the situation that their writing services will no longer be required?

One might speculate that they would prefer to see CGL fail so that they have an opportunity to write for Shadowrun in the future with a different company.

One might also speculate that one would want to thoroughly kiss the current owner's ass in order to get paid...

I mean, I get being angry about not getting paid. I get being angry enough to quit. I even sort get being angry enough to stomp your foot and take advantage of the copyright laws (despite how that definitely puts a kink in you ever getting paid). I can even almost -- almost -- get being angry because other people don't share your anger. What I don't get is being angry about actually getting paid, and I don't get being so outraged that a business might actually be a little on the corrupt side and using that to somehow justify such irrational rage over any and everything under the sun.

At that point it just goes from being pissy and bitter to outright insanity.

This bit is awesome.

I get this crawling sensation on the back of my neck that someone out there is angling to acquire the Shadowrun license, much akin to the way people were going after the IP rights when Topps closed Wizkids proper back last year. Again, this is only a hunch on the back of my neck; I've read lots of discussion of people wishing to do so, but very little public action.

The thing I wonder, though, is this: If someone were trying to accomplish that, how would they go about it? You could be either underhanded or open and forthright about it, and either has just as much chance of succeeding. Maybe I'm deluding myself in thinking I'd take the higher road and not try to ruin people in the process of crafting the game into my vision, but who knows. I just feel that in all my doings online, it is best to leave a positive trail and not come across negatively, for someone, somewhere, will be able to find the dirt. Especially if it is someplace fairly public.

(Sorry about the not-so-vague tone, this has been on my mind for a while and I couldn't hold back any longer.)

This one is just a little bit funny. I like how the whistleblowers are the bad guys in his little head.

They need to just shut all this crap down.

I mean, what are the naysayers going to do? Claim that Dumpshock is overmoderated and the moderators are evil, vicious, CGL-cocksucking douchenozzles? How on earth is that any different than what they're doing now? Better to just shut it down and tell everyone to piss off and get over it. Much like they did with the Bulldrek and Lounge forums years and years ago.

Yes, because prohibiting people from discussing things is going to solve all the problems. Poor communication has been the solution and not the problem up until now.

And here we have the eternal problem with this thread, even though Patrick has written for Shadowrun in the past and has a track record, because his opinion differs with Fuchs he shouldn't write for Shadowrun, I for one am very glad that Fuchs whoever the heck he is doesn't actually call the shots. In absence of actual ability to affect change some of those in the anti-CGL crowd are basically resorting to falsehoods. character assassination and other forms of personal attacks. Everyone who doesn't agree with them is some variant of corporate shill or "blindly loyal to the corp" or whatever other cliche they can think of, nothing new at this point.


PS: Patrick was one of those who withheld copywrite to get paid, I guess he blindly loves his corp.

Obviously the "Cult of Frank" members are the only one who have spoke ill of anyone in the last weeks...



Note that those go back to April 21 only. I couldn't bring myself to read anymore of the past topics.

[The Vigilante]

Wow, am I the only one who has a problem with this page's display ? It only shows the topic on the left half of the screen. Did I do that ? How do I fix it ?

EDIT : now this post is on the right ?!! What is this I don't even

[Dominicius]

Wow, am I the only one who has a problem with this page's display ? It only shows the topic on the left half of the screen. Did I do that ? How do I fix it ?

EDIT : now this post is on the right ?!! What is this I don't even

Fix your quote tags.

[The Vigilante]

OK Done.

[Stahlseele]

Frank, I know you've stated in the past that Ancient History isn't really handy around rules and numbers, but how valuable do you think he is as a fluff writer, compared to the ones they replaced him with ?

As a Fluff-Writer he is in my eyes, pretty much irreplaceable.
You can basically ask him ANY Question about the World/Background of SR aside from the Rules. Chances are you will get an answer immediately. And some interesting tidbits and tangents that might be connected peripherically.

[Ganbare Gincun]

I'm glad to see that the fine folks at Dumpshock are willing to justify the actions of white collar criminals in a vain attempt to maintain their "status" within the "Shadowrun community". I suppose that all of the companies that have been defrauded by Loren Coleman and the federal agents that are no doubt investigating his crimes are also part of the "Cult Of Saint Frank"?

These guys are almost as bad as Transformer Fans.

[Jilocasin]

I mean, I get being angry about not getting paid. I get being angry enough to quit. I even sort get being angry enough to stomp your foot and take advantage of the copyright laws (despite how that definitely puts a kink in you ever getting paid). I can even almost -- almost -- get being angry because other people don't share your anger. What I don't get is being angry about actually getting paid, and I don't get being so outraged that a business might actually be a little on the corrupt side and using that to somehow justify such irrational rage over any and everything under the sun.

At that point it just goes from being pissy and bitter to outright insanity.

I think the part I italicized is actually more telling. Apparently he "sort of" understands an individual asserting their rights and it sounds to me like he views using copyright law in such a way as some kind of loophole.

These guys are almost as bad as Transformer Fans.

How do you mean? I like the transformers, though granted I don't know crap about the fandom of transformers, and I like to think I'm not a morally bankrupt raving lunatic.

[Koumei]

and the federal agents that are no doubt investigating his crimes are also part of the "Cult Of Saint Frank"?

That would be completely awesome. If the feds were all part of this cult*, ready to act on his command.

*which doesn't fucking exist. But if they were and it did.

[Crissa]

Lemme get this straight... You, your friends, and the license you want to work for aren't being paid for because of 'a little corruption'. So you don't have a place to complain that the source of the corruption is rounding up scabs to work and be paid the money which is already owed you, and they're saying you burnt bridges?

Ugh. Has anyone made sure to point these actions out to the fed dept of labor (for nonpayment of wages, requiring of illegal activities) and the local police (for passing the bad checks?)

I know people often forget, but there are lots of places to report this stuff. Of course, if they merely didn't pay you, you can't get the cops involved, but you can use civil court same as any creditor.

-Crissa

[Fuchs]

According to the PMs I get from admins I keep getting reported for my posts.

[Jilocasin]

According to the PMs I get from admins I keep getting reported for my posts.

Being a voice of reason apparently has that effect.

[The Vigilante]

Dumpshock forums are so full of blind fanboys it makes me sick...

[Akula]

Dumpshock forums are so full of blind fanboys it makes me sick...

I've called it Dumbshock for a while now. Oh, and *ahem* David A. Hill is a whiny bitch. (suck on that google alert, jackass)

[Utterfail]

After the Signature + David A. Hill = Google alert thing (which a few people have done) I'd be surprised if he hasn't blocked alerts from this site.

[Koumei]

I'd be surprised if he hasn't blocked alerts from this site.

And from 4chan's /y/ board. And from pastebin.

[Utterfail]

Someone should make a bot like the one that was on here a while ago that will type up random, semi-informative stuff about David A. Hill and go out and post it on random unsecured forums.

...I kinda miss that 'bot, he was cool till he went all advertisement-y.

[fbmf]

[The Great Fence Builder Speaks]

I do believe this thread has served its purpose. If any further INFORMATION or UPDATES become available, PM me and I could be persuaded to re-open.

[/TGFBS]