Fixing D20 Modern Classes

[Utterfail]

Recently, me and a buddy of mine have been brainstorming ideas for fixing D20 modern. It had some neat ideas, but I think we can all agree that d20 modern as a whole was a failure that accomplished few of the things it set out to do well. So, the first thing on the chopping block is classes. D20 modern seemed to want to be able to represent the everyman, generic classes for the modern world people don't fit into a little pigeonhole of an archetype. Problem is, they ended up with 6 generic classes with specific talents tied to each of them

Bear in mind we plan to use new talent trees to replace the crap talent trees, and would be using the [Tome] combat and skill feats (along with tome-ifying the few modern skills and combat options)

Generating Your Class

In order to generate a class, each player receives 6 tokens that they can spend freely on different features of their class. The base value of each feature (before tokens are spent) are thus: HD starts at a d6, Skills start at 3+Int per level, Base Attack Bonus starts out at 1/2 advancement rate, each save starts out that the +1/2 advancement rate, and defense starts out at the crappy "smart hero" rate of +1 for every three levels.

Up to two tokens can be spent on HD, increasing it to a d8, then to a d10. Up to three tokens can be placed on skills, giving two more skill ranks per level per token up to a maximum of 9 per level. Base attack bonus can have up to two tokens spent on it, increasing it to +3/4 and then +1 advancement. Each save can have a token placed on it, increasing it to the good save progression (The D&D one, not the dumbass D20 Modern one). And lastly defense can have up to two tokens placed on it, increasing it to the mediocre strong hero advancement, and then to the awesomesauce fast hero advancement.

Reputation was stupid, we killed it.

Now that you have your class, you get to choose a talent every odd level, and a feat every even level. And you get that feat for being first level. And for being human.

Oh, and no more feats every third level, picking a feat every other level is enough.

Why 6 tokens?

Most people agree that Fast Hero was the cool class, it takes 6 tokens to emulate the fast hero. All the other classes take 5 tokens... except the dedicated hero, that takes 4.

Who gets what talents?

Whatever your highest ability score is determines what sort of hero you are. If Dexterity is your highest score, you're a Fast Hero. If its Intelligence you get to be a Smart Hero, etc

From now on, all talents have an [ABILITY] tag (Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence, etc). As long as you are that sort of hero, there are no limits to how many talents for that ability you can accrue. All other talents however are limited. You can only have Ability Score - 10 number of talents that relate to that ability score. This way, if you have a decent Int you can pick up a few Smart Hero shticks if you want to, but the "Grr, im big and dumb guy" wont.

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So, what do you guys think? Any glaring holes we missed?

[Username17]

So, what do you guys think? Any glaring holes we missed?

It is objectively factual that if you bail on a class before the 3rd level that there is no difference at all between ½ and ¾ BAB.

And of course, there's the problem that if you're building the classes on a point system that you don't even have classes or any of the advantages they represent. So basically you might as well just skip all that crap and have a single class called "hero" with whatever available abilities you think heroes should have.

-Username17

[CatharzGodfoot]

What happens when a character has multiple ability score stied for highest? What happens when a character boosts a formerly lower attribute above her 'prime requisite'?

Also, I don't think that the increase from 5 skills to 7 is worth as much as 3 to 5, simply because of the number of skills that are good. 3 -> 5 -> 8 [-> 12] or 3 -> 6 -> 9 might work out better.

That said, there's already a decent modern system out there, and it isn't d20. It's 4e Shadowrun. So long as you tone down magic at least as much as you tone down technology, it to our modern world decently well.

[Josh_Kablack]

That said, there's already a decent modern system out there, and it isn't d20. It's 4e Shadowrun.

Or Feng Shui (and it's obscure origin game Nexus)
Or HERO
Or even GURPS.
Or Heck, even if you have to stick to D20, there's Spycraft.

There's just no compelling reason for me to chose D20 Modern over its competitors - and that makes me not to even want to bother to try to houserule it.

[Utterfail]

And of course, there's the problem that if you're building the classes on a point system that you don't even have classes or any of the advantages they represent. So basically you might as well just skip all that crap and have a single class called "hero" with whatever available abilities you think heroes should have.

You're absolutely right there, I think 'class' is a misnomer on my part. The true aim is essentially to make a classless modular system where each player gets to chose the basics of his hero that are traditionally chosen by picking a predefined class. So the players really do give whatever abilities they feel a 'hero' should have to their character.

It is objectively factual that if you bail on a class before the 3rd level that there is no difference at all between ½ and ¾ BAB.

Also true, but since you build the one class that you get, and there won't be any multiclassing (I didn't say that before, so that was my bad) there should still be incentive to select ¾ BAB if you plan on getting past second level.

What happens when a character has multiple ability score stied for highest? What happens when a character boosts a formerly lower attribute above her 'prime requisite'?

If they tie, you choose one at creation. If one advances past your "defining score" then... You'd be weird, but you would still be the same sort of hero. No need to get all crazy with the rules and generate a loophole.

I don't think that the increase from 5 skills to 7 is worth as much as 3 to 5, simply because of the number of skills that are good. 3 -> 5 -> 8 [-> 12] or 3 -> 6 -> 9 might work out better.

I like 3 -> 6 -> 9.

That said, there's already a decent modern system out there, and it isn't d20.

The intended players are all d20 players already, and have played modern. I don't want to frighten them off.

Spycraft

I'll look into that, I doubt it'd fly for this game though.

[nora10]

Addressing D20 Modern classes requires a nuanced approach. Balancing class abilities, refining skill progression, and ensuring versatility are crucial. Incorporate player feedback and playtesting to identify and rectify potential issues. Consider introducing additional class features or adjusting existing ones to promote diversity and strategic depth. A collaborative effort with the gaming community can lead to a more engaging and balanced gaming experience.magic 8 ball