Designing a super rogue

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virgil
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Designing a super rogue

Post by virgil »

I'm going to be in a short term game, level 20, virtually every book allowed; with the crazy-town tricks banned (no use of wish for infinite wealth/magic items, no balor mining, no phoenix duplication, no high-end UMD with the staff of blasphemy).

Our party's goal is to hunt down and kill various Abyssal Lords.

I'm thinking of being a pure rogue with a level in shadowdancer for HiPS, dual-wielding ghost touch kusari-gamas (ring of blinking).

Feats: Three chosen by Shadowdancer, Darkstalker, Weapon Finesse, Two-Weapon Fighting, Leadership, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (kusari-gama)

Gear
*Staff with persistent wraithstrike, golemstrike, grave strike, vine strike, & sniper's shot, along with mindblank.
* Staff with greater magic weapon, magic vestments.
* Two blessed ghost touch evil outsider bane kusari-gamas (one of speed).
* Ring of Blinking.
* Gloves of Dexterity +6
* +1 mithral breastplate of heavy fortification with greater arrrow deflection crystal
* Rogue's Vest (+1d6 sneak attack)
* Cloak of Resist +5
* Ring of Chameleon (+10 Hide)
* Slippers of Move Silently +10

I haven't chosen race, close to 3/4ths of my gear, etc. I was wondering if you guys had any advice for me, either on further thins to choose, or even pointers on my grave errors thus far.
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Maxus
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by Maxus »

Man, that sound like the equivalent of turning on all the cheat codes so you start off using the best stuff...

Anyway. I'm away from my books, but I can remember some stuff.

I think there's an item enhancement called Deadly Precision that gives you +2d6 extra sneak attack, costs a +2 enhancement.

My immediate source to dig through for cool equipment, Planewalker's item list, is turning up some stuff.

So's you can look for yourself...

http://www.planewalker.com/snail/equipm ... [br]Jerkin of the Brazen Rogue
Mercykiller Ring (Daaang, this thing is underpriced...)
Sensate Amulet
Demon Bowls could play a role, too. Any fiend that comes withing 60 feet of the bowl has to make a DC 22 will save or be sealed into the bowl.

But, really, at that level, you could very well hand out minor artifacts for the players.

Fiendbane looks like it'd break this, as well as Hellblade and Heavenblade.
Heaven and Earth looks fun, as does Stormclaw...

Maybe you'd like to show this to your DM so he can get some ideas. I don't care. I'm about to go get some chocolate-covered pretzels. :smile:
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
CalibronXXX
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by CalibronXXX »

Blade of Pain and fear, 2nd level spell in Libris Mortis. Gives you a melee weapon that does 1d6+1 per 2 cls, uses touch attacks, and causes a save versus fear when damaging an opponent for 1 minute per level. Get a pair of use activated wondrous items shaped like weapon hilts that activate when you draw them. Tell Wraithstrike, which can be negated with something as simple as ghost touch armor, to go fuck itself.
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virgil
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by virgil »

Actually, ghost touch makes the armor work against incorporeal foes. Wraithstrike specifically states that my melee attacks are resolved as melee touch attacks, not that they count as incorporeal attacks.
Come see Sprockets & Serials
How do you confuse a barbarian?
Put a greatsword a maul and a greataxe in a room and ask them to take their pick
EXPLOSIVE RUNES!
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JonSetanta
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by JonSetanta »

Screw +10 Hide and MS.

Use items that grant constant Invisibility and Silence, or maybe even Ghostform or some sort of swarm shape.
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virgil
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by virgil »

I have HiPS, so I get that effect anyway. At this level, true seeing rears its ugly head ALOT; so I want something it can't handle, which is skill checks. I'll probably have to get a higher bonus for the Hide, and I'll cook up a silence field that only fills my space (and then likely drop the move silent bonus item).
Come see Sprockets & Serials
How do you confuse a barbarian?
Put a greatsword a maul and a greataxe in a room and ask them to take their pick
EXPLOSIVE RUNES!
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CatharzGodfoot
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by CatharzGodfoot »

Got a race yet? Whisper gnome?
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CalibronXXX
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by CalibronXXX »

Yup, you're right, I misremembered it specifically referencing selective incorporeality instead of vaguely calling it ghostly and transparent.
SunTzuWarmaster
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by SunTzuWarmaster »

What, no ranged attacks?

What, you can't fly (or climb)?

Heavy Fortification Breastplate, I know it's mithril, but it seems like you dex should be higher than that if you are a rogue.

Ditch the speed weapon, get Boots of Speed with Move Silently (50% extra for the second enchantment). Personally, I would go for boots of (Speed+Spiderclimb+Move Silently).

Leadership - get a wizard? Make him use the staffs? Make him just memorize the spells?

You get some rogue bonus abilities, you know. Gape of the Serpent! Do it, you are required by Frank to do so.
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Maxus
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by Maxus »


SunTzu wrote:You get some rogue bonus abilities, you know. Gape of the Serpent! Do it, you are required by Frank to do so.


:lmao:

If I tried to use Gape of the Serpent as a Rogue, my current DM would be like, "He has a dagger and cuts himself out of you."

But that does raise a point. Skill Mastery can get you all your fiend-slayin' skills--Hide, Move Silently, Spot, Listen UMD--if you have decent Int. Maybe you could plug Use Magic Device and run around with Holy Avenger thinking you're a paladin named Maurice the Mighty Man. For Example.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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virgil
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by virgil »

Hmm, I'm going to have to change the plans a bit. Turns out that the DM is ruling that there are no custom items (going to have to check to see if I can at least make staves with spells of choice, especially metamagicked ones) AND that darkvision will override the shadowdancer's HiPS because from its PoV there are no shadows to allow use of the ability.
Come see Sprockets & Serials
How do you confuse a barbarian?
Put a greatsword a maul and a greataxe in a room and ask them to take their pick
EXPLOSIVE RUNES!
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CatharzGodfoot
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by CatharzGodfoot »

Then get a ring of darkhidden.
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Mount Flamethrower on rear
Drive in reverse
Win Game.

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virgil
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by virgil »

Still not going to work against the many high CR tanar'ri we'll be running into, which tend to have large true seeing effects running; which work as darkvision at the same time.
Come see Sprockets & Serials
How do you confuse a barbarian?
Put a greatsword a maul and a greataxe in a room and ask them to take their pick
EXPLOSIVE RUNES!
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CatharzGodfoot
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by CatharzGodfoot »

Ok, get a blindfold of true darkness and an eversmoking bottle. And a good listen check.
The law in its majestic equality forbids the rich as well as the poor from stealing bread, begging and sleeping under bridges.
-Anatole France

Mount Flamethrower on rear
Drive in reverse
Win Game.

-Josh Kablack

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Judging__Eagle
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by Judging__Eagle »

Actually, you should counter to the DM that Darkvision doesn't eliminate shadows or darkness.

You can still tell when your in the dark, b/c everything is in black and white in the shadows/darkness.

HiPS still works if you have darkvision.

Heck, by definition, a Shadow Dance could be holding the torch and then hiding in a companion's shadow. So long as he doesn't try to hide in his own shadow.

The Deadly Precision ability is a so-so choice since it's a +2 ability to add +2d6 more SA dice. Not always useful.

I'd reccomend getting the Extending ability; it's a +1 ability that moves the threatened range of staved weapons, polearms, chains and whips outwards by 5'. So, you'd threaten 15-10 feet away instead of 10-5, giving you some more breathing room and a chance to get in an extra AoO.

It was in a Dragon article; Crystalkeep should have it listed. If not I can look through my issues of dragon and dig it up.

An other tip that might help would be to get an item that casts Fog Cloud (or whatever the 'at range' Obscuring Mist spell is called) and get a Blindfold of True Darkness; True Seeing can't se through solid interference, and you've got Blindsight so you can.

I'd have Reccomeneded getting goggles of Ebon Eyes and an item that can cast Blacklight on an item that your character carries. Always have the goggles on and when you need to fight some guys, pull the cover off of the Blacklight item and they can't see you.


...wait, Is it Devils or Demons that can see in magical darkness? b/c that's what Blacklight is, magical darkness that bones Darkvision. In a massive radius and with a duration of days.
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by shirak »

  • Deadly Precision adds 2d6 damage whenever you fulfill the criteria for a SA. It's not extra SA damage which means it works against everything immune to criticals and it's dog. It's actually pretty good.
  • Your bonus feat can be any feat ever printed. I suggest getting Perfect Two Weapon Fighting from the D&D Jokebook and freeing up your feat slots to use for Martial Stance and Whatever.
  • You get any maneuver at all and Assassin's Stance which gives you +2d6 SA from now till forever.
  • Get 50 Hypothermic Needles. Fill them with buffs, Shivering Touch and other bad stuff. Then throw them at enemies. Good times.
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by Endovior »

virgileso at [unixtime wrote:1198218213[/unixtime]]Hmm, I'm going to have to change the plans a bit. Turns out that the DM is ruling that there are no custom items (going to have to check to see if I can at least make staves with spells of choice, especially metamagicked ones) AND that darkvision will override the shadowdancer's HiPS because from its PoV there are no shadows to allow use of the ability.


That's not how it works at all. You can hide from an dwarf in his own shadow from ten feet away in an open area under broad daylight while throwing things at him... and if you can make the checks, he can't see or hear you doing it.

It's not a matter of darkness (negated by darkvision), it's a matter of shadows. If there are walls, flickery torches, multiple combatants, etc, etc, etc... there are shadows that you can hide in.

The only thing that totally banishes all shadows altogether are high-end light spells... and even then, only within a certain radius; outside of which the light will cast shadows.
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Re: Designing a super rogue

Post by JonSetanta »

Judging__Eagle at [unixtime wrote:1198561136[/unixtime]]
...wait, Is it Devils or Demons that can see in magical darkness? b/c that's what Blacklight is, magical darkness that bones Darkvision. In a massive radius and with a duration of days.


Devils, although oddly there are no Hellish (LE) realms of pure darkness.
Most are on fire. Which creates light.
Go figure.
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