Ulisses Spiele tries to launch Das Schwarze Auge in the US

Rasumichin · Post by **Rasumichin** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 8:23 pm

silva wrote:
Shlominus wrote:no one plays dsa becasue they prefer the system over any other. the system is terrible! and that's me speaking as someone who has 2 dsa-campaigns active, with another one planned. Wink
So its like Shadowrun.

DSA is so bad that Germans actually like Shadowrun.

zugschef · Post by **zugschef** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 10:16 pm

I don't have anything productive to say, so I'll say this: the best thing about dsa are the computer games from '92, '94 and '96.

Daniel · Post by **Daniel** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:03 am

Found this hidden away in the comments section of the facebook page.

The Aventuria Map Set for the English edition is slated for September release, with a detailed map of Aventuria, a smaller map of Aventuria, a black and white map of Aventuria, an in-game map of Aventuria, an in-game map of Dere, the regions of Aventuria, and a political map of Aventuria.

So apparently they have a detailed release schedule planned at least from may till oktober.

Still figuring out if the weird feeling I have is dread or excitement.

Rasumichin · Post by **Rasumichin** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:11 am

These maps have been around since the early 1990s. Is there anything else they want to put out? Like, a book that actually gives you a description of these places?

Daniel · Post by **Daniel** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 9:01 pm

They haven't posted a release schedule, they just implicitly admitted having one covering at least the 5 months from may till oktober.

Presumably it will mostly be copy of the German one. So they'll start with a core rulebook, a bestiary, a setting guide and a couple of adventures (incl. a solo module)) for beginners.

Daniel · Post by **Daniel** » Tue May 10, 2016 12:26 am

So there is now a kickstarter underway for the English version of DSA 5.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/12 ... =discovery

But more interesting to readers here is probably the following. Enjoy.

The Mechanics

I’ll admit, I’m not a fan of the 20-sided die. I dislike the small-sample problems it creates in most games where it is used. Too often when I’m playing other popular d20 fantasy games I get stuck with terrible rolls for things that I should be good at. I have become very reluctant to play any d20 games where I don’t get rerolls or after-roll adjustments.

But The Dark Eye just works better. Roll under makes for more predictable math than the usual roll+modifier mechanic. And even more than that, TDE offers both after-roll adjustments and rerolls. I particularly enjoy the non-combat skill system, which involves groups of skills tied to combinations of attributes. This is probably the most mechanically unique thing about TDE, and it deserves its own detailed discussion. It may seem a bit odd when you are first trying it out, but it’s really quite elegant once you get used to it.

What I will say about it briefly is that it emphasizes those skills more than I’ve seen in other fantasy games. In many systems, it can feel futile to try something unless you excel at it, but The Dark Eye encourages you to explore many different approaches and solutions, especially those that feel the most in-character. But at the same time, it makes characters feel competent at their skill specialties.

And it’s the little things that I appreciate as well: I like active defense. I enjoy an armor system that actually reduces damage instead of making me harder to hit. I like the narrow band of initiative results, so that quick characters are always quick. I like systems that include a degree of success, and I particularly love how The Dark Eye handles that feature. And overall I just like how boardgame-level pretty it is.
http://www.ulisses-us.com/blog/why-shou ... this-game/

norms29 · Post by **norms29** » Tue May 10, 2016 4:36 am

Roll under makes for more predictable math than the usual roll+modifier mechanic.

Pardon-fuck?

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Tue May 10, 2016 6:20 am

norms29 wrote:
Roll under makes for more predictable math than the usual roll+modifier mechanic.
Pardon-fuck?

Well, that was stupid. But probably not as stupid as the claim that after roll modifiers were better than roll+modifier.

All in all, that screed was so full of retarded that I have no intention of even looking at the edition. It's a math-challenged rant about how we should all be using bad mechanics from the mid eighties. As it happens, we should not.

-Username17

Daniel · Post by **Daniel** » Tue May 10, 2016 6:41 am

The boring explanation is that this is simply an American hired gun who is getting payed to hype this weird German system over Pathfinder/D&D.

But if somebody here wants to unpack his actual arguments, well...

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue May 10, 2016 10:42 am

which involves groups of skills tied to combinations of attributes

So, like Shadowrun 4/5 and whitewolf or wherever that was stolen from then?

DrPraetor · Post by **DrPraetor** » Tue May 10, 2016 1:19 pm

Stahlseele wrote:
which involves groups of skills tied to combinations of attributes
So, like Shadowrun 4/5 and whitewolf or wherever that was stolen from then?

Skills being grouped and tied to mathematically-nonsensical heaps of attributes is very much part of the early-80s RPG soup.

For example, in Powers & Perils, your http://powersandperils.org/newskills.htm#Eroticist
skill started at the highest of Will, Empathy, Agility or Appearance, divided by 20 (RU), and maxed out at the sum of those divided by 20 (RU).

phlapjackage · Post by **phlapjackage** » Tue May 10, 2016 4:21 pm

Downloaded the quick start rules...

For every skill, skill group (physical, social, nature,
knowledge, crafts), and spell, there are three attributes.
You roll against these attributes in sequence. You can
decide in which order you want to make your rolls, but
you must determine against which attribute you roll be-
fore rolling the die.

So every skill/spell check is x3 rolls...and you also have to decide what "order" you want to roll beforehand...

Slade · Post by **Slade** » Tue May 10, 2016 4:31 pm

norms29 wrote:
Roll under makes for more predictable math than the usual roll+modifier mechanic.
Pardon-fuck?

I think because you know the DC (after all you are rolling under your own stats) he thinks it is more predictable.

But that only works for newbies, no?
After playing you should realize how hard the DCs are for roll+modifier mechanic. I mean, for example, 3.5 D&D tells you Tumble DC for avoid AoO. Unless you aren't playing attention, then I guess you'd be surprised.

Daniel · Post by **Daniel** » Fri May 13, 2016 4:26 am

phlapjackage wrote:
So every skill/spell check is x3 rolls...and you also have to decide what "order" you want to roll beforehand...

Yes. DSA/TDE is amazingly stupid.

In its defense, this might finally be the edition in which you can play, sir Lancelot, granny Weatherwax, Raistlin Majere, Sancho Panza and Tarzan teaming up, with everybody being equally useful with only a minimum of DM fuzz.
If it nails that target, it is a masterpiece, despite the stupid.

Zaranthan · Post by **Zaranthan** » Fri May 13, 2016 3:40 pm

FrankTrollman wrote:Well, that was stupid. But probably not as stupid as the claim that after roll modifiers were better than roll+modifier.

Eh, I could see a defense for an ability to add +5 to a roll after the die comes out, so you could declare it in response to rolling low. D&D has the "take 10 in combat" ability that's vastly smoother for the result you want, but a lot of people aren't comfortable with doing that for attack rolls or saving throws, even if it is your signature ability. They'd prefer you just balance the ability around never failing rather than letting you take 10 on a combat roll, but they'd also be okay with spending a resource to improve a poor roll.

I say make it never miss or trust the d20. No middle ground. Final Destination.