Old Game Review: Ninjas and Superspies (TM)

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:59 am

I have only seen the "exercise for the elderly" form. I wasn't aware an actual combat form existed. And well, you've already seen my opinion of DIM MAK and aikido and all that. If you want to win a fight, it's:
1. Be the person choosing when and where the fight takes place (so "be the mugger")
2. Use a machinegun
3. If you can't have either of the above, then worst case scenario, you want either boxing or kickboxing or jujutsu, either way you need to have had real fighting experience with it, with your training actually involving "you two, get into the pit and fight until one person taps out or blacks out."

Silent Wayfarer · Post by **Silent Wayfarer** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:19 am

Taichi combat forms are massively speeded up over the exercise forms.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:49 am

I can only say that when I was jumped by several people armed with knives and rocks, that I was very glad that I had trained in Aikido. I don't think I would have gotten very far trying to punch my way out of that situation.

-Username17

Count Arioch the 28th · Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:12 am

The few times as an adult that I felt threatened I forget everything I learned from Tai Chi, Karate, and Wrestling and resorted to picking up the nearest object and chucking it at them. Throw a big enough rock at someone and they tend to back off even if you miss.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:21 am

As a disclaimer, I have zero in-ring experience and all of my fighting experience is that of huddling on the ground because I need to get past that fear reflex and properly turn into a killer.

So I'm not speaking from any authority of my own, just going by:
1. Aikido is fucking never used by the winners in any kind of MMA thing. At least, not exclusively, I think some people have it as a secondary while they main in a striking art.
2. When I was looking into martial arts training, I specifically said I wanted to learn to defend myself and even the fucking Wu Shu people laughed at the idea of Aikido. The instructor for Wu Shu was honest enough to say "You probably want to go with Muay Thai then, not what we're offering."
3. Bullshido, which is so kind as to provide a list of the top five bullshit martial arts you should laugh at, and I think we can all agree that lists on the Internet are 100% true.

But I am honestly curious as to what methods you used to get out of that situation, Frank.

talozin · Post by **talozin** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 4:59 pm

I'm guessing that "runningthefuckawaydo" was heavily involved. Gregor Clegane would have a hard time beating up three-plus armed opponents who have the element of surprise.

Mask_De_H · Post by **Mask_De_H** » Thu Jan 21, 2016 5:41 pm

The thing is, Koumei, there's arts for starting shit and there's arts for getting out of shit. Soft arts and grappling arts are good for getting out of shit, as they teach you escapes and limb control, which is useful when someone has a weapon or has already grabbed you for surprise sex. Judo is the more "respected" of those arts since it doesn't have as much spiritual bullshit.

MT and boxing are stand up arts, which you use when you personally trying to fuck someone up. You can't box on the ground or when grabbed, and MT's clinch game presumes you're the one grappling. Also, a dude with a weapon has a reach advantage regardless of your stand up style.

If you're going to a Wu Shu dojo to learn "self-defense", they assume you're learning it for "fucking people up". Which is why they laughed at a defensive art and told you to to learn an art for fucking people up.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:26 am

Well, as a smaller combatant, if attacked I pretty much need to either take someone down with a punch to the throat, or initiate a throw and then choke them out without waiting for them to attack me first. Because standing there and letting someone else attempt to stab you with a knife, even when you are anticipating the attack, sounds like a really stupid idea.

Anyway, now we look at the Rifter (TM) 7: World Warriors. "More than Karate and Kung Fu". This one is mainly for branching out away from "Japan, Korea and China".

It starts with BJJ: has some stat requirements, and it's a grappling art. Has more strikes than regular Jujutsu, has the usual throws, head lock, elbow lock, knee lock, wrist lock, body lock. No, the Rifter (TM) 3 did not provide rules for breaking someone's neck from a headlock or spine/ribs from a body lock. It just means it's a hold but they take a little damage any time they try to escape. No choking, oddly enough, but it has a Shoot-Through, which is a low-damage tackle that lets you automatically transition into a joint lock. Has Body Building for free, lets you take Body Hardening and Martial Arts Techs. B

Capoeira (Exclusive): you get a whole bunch of stat boosts, but only 2 attacks per round, and you don't get the universal Auto-Parry until third level. Has heaps and heaps of kicks, including a bunch of unique ones to the art that aren't actually that effective. Also has the headscissors takedown (body flip that deals 1d8 damage), and a lunging headbutt to the stomach. Has a Weapon Kata for holding a straightrazor between the toes, and has the option to choose between fighting normally or automatically losing initiative on round one but getting +2 to the Init roll thereafter. If other people are clapping or whatever to set a beat (wearing an ipod doesn't help because it's the atmosphere), you get +2 to flashier moves. Has Gymnastics, some Performance skills, and two options from Body Hardening and Martial Art Techs. This is the Monk of martial arts, it gets heaps and heaps of shitty things instead of actually being good and dedicated at something. Having Gymnastics for free and some decent base stats saves it from being the absolute worst, so it get C-.

Jeet Kun Do: technically it's American. 3 attacks, a bunch of stat boosts, gets a bunch of strikes and either one Weapon Kata or +1 to Parry and Dodge. Only one power (Body Hardening or Martial Arts Techs), the new Antici.....pation skill and one physical skill choice (includes Acrobatics, Gymnastics and Boxing!) Gets quite a few boosts to Initiative as well as the usual striking things. Overall I'd say a B- because it's good for rushing in and hitting people but doesn't really make use of powers and stuff.

Kick Boxing (non-Thai): okay, so you get 3 attacks per round and a whole payload of kicks. You also get the ability to clinch such that only snap kicks and knee attacks are allowed and it's tough shit if your opponent doesn't have those attacks. Knee strike is only 1d6 mind you. Also has a switch-kick that deals 2d6+2 but can only be used once per turn (and is not as good as just having a 6d6 roundhouse kick thanks to being a RIFTS (TM) character with Chagi Foot Hardening) and a kick to the thigh that deals 1d10 and the opponent has to Save vs Pain or lose one attack and Initiative. Two physical skills of choice except for Gymnastics and Acrobatics (so you take Boxing and perhaps Body Building or Ballet), only one power (MA or BH). Completely cranks up the bonuses to hit people, gets another +4 attacks over the career and ends up critting on a 17+. From just a brute-force perspective it's very tasty, A-.

Krav Mahga: this is the ONLY MARTIAL ART TAUGHT TO MILITARY (except for judo, boxing, collegiate wrestling and a few others). And obviously, MOSSAD use this as their main form of killing people - they don't use guns and just rely on this in a pinch, no, they kick your entire house down so it LOOKS like they bombed it, and then- yeah okay, basically what I'm saying is this has hilarious levels of Internet wankery over it. Not that it needs to be ineffective, as long as you do study it the way military people do: in a way that involves hobbling home from classes and stitching your face back together. But I like to think there's someone reading this who has a huge hard-on over Krav Mahga, and who is going to be really pissed off reading this.

Only 2 attacks, mild stat boosts, bizarre boost to MA, and has Combo Parry/Attack and Power Parry. Remember what I said about them actually not being good though. Has a bunch of solid strikes, as well as Fingertip Attack (note: no powers at all, so you have no Atemi powers to channel through this). Wrist/Elbow/Head Lock, basic throw, and Knife Kata. You get one physical skill that has a few limits and therefore will be Boxing. Now, at level one you crit on a 19-20, and at level 20 that's 15-20, fuck yes. Lots of Deathblow/Auto-KO stuff, which is a shame, what with those being called shots that we will now ignore. Only gets an extra 2 attacks over the whole career, which really ruins it. I'm giving it a C+ because if it just had more attacks per round, the crit range would be really nice.

Munen Muso, which is apparently Australian: 2 attacks, bonus to PP and MA, Auto Throw, Combo Parry/Attack, Auto Lock, Power Parry, Combo Parry/Lock. Grappling style. Only a few strikes, has Wrist/Elbow/Neck/Finger locks and a Torso Hold. Weapon Katas for Knife, Short Blunt, Paired, and Handcuffs - if you have someone in a wrist, finger or elbow lock you can spend one attack (or zero attacks if you're holding the cuffs already) to snap them on. That's kind of cool actually. You start off with one physical skill which will be Boxing, and two Martial Art Techs. You end up learning one Atemi, one more MA Tech, and one more "either of the above". It's not a bad style, but the Atemi stuff comes in pretty late and that's one of the things it has going for it. I'll give it a B-.

Pancracean: 3 attacks, nice stat boosts, combo Parry/Attack, Combo Parry/Throw, Wrist/Elbow Lock, some decent punches and kicks, and one Body Hardening and one physical skill that will be Boxing. It sort of improves everything as you progress - more attacks, wider Crit range, bonus to hit and to grapple and to dodge and all that, and you also eventually get the Lightning Kata of Muay Thai. B

Pro Boxing/Pugilism: they note that you can't take this and also the Boxing physical skill. "The same is true of Tai Chi and Kickboxing, described below". I don't know if that means "You can't take the Tai Chi martial art and also the Tai Chi skill" (ditto Kickboxing) or if it means "You also can't take those two skills with this martial art". 4 base attacks, and a fairly bulky stat boost with +20 SDC. You only get strike, Power Punch and Quick Jab (1 point of damage, no it does not actually hit faster or anything). Also has a "Press Defence" where you sort of grab your opponent and hope they're not a grappler or kickboxer. Also, this one gets the special "Don't pre-declare your KO attacks: if you roll the right number on an attack, you knock them out." Also has Body Building and Athletics and Antici.... pation. And one Body Hardening power that may be swapped for a physical skill.

Ends up with a good number of attacks and some extra powers and SDC boosts, and yes, KO slowly scales from natural 20 (level 1) to 16+ (level 15). If all you want to do is punch some asshole in the head and knock them out, this is basically the one for you, so it gets an A.

Command Sambo (exclusive): the picture isn't exactly Zangief, but it may as well be. Actually he's choking someone even though you don't get chokeholds from Sambo in this game. Only 2 base attacks, +20 SDC, +2 MA, +3 PE, +4 PS, so already you can see how this is going. Combo Parry/Attack (and automatic as well), Autho Throw, Disarm, a few strikes, and yes, it's a grappling and ground-fighting style. Elbow/Head/Wrist lock, no mention of bridging German Suplexes and Leaping Spinning Piledrivers. Next you'll be telling me Yoga doesn't let you breathe fire and teleport. You gain Body Building and one MA Tech and two Body Hardening. They can be swapped out for physical skills. Also you have Weapon Kata: Knife. Over the course of your career you get heaps of extra SDC, big bonuses to grappling, and automatic Death Blow from behind. Okay, I guess THAT is the double bridging German Suplex followed by a spinning leaping Piledriver. B+ for sheer brute force.

(Note: they suggest adding it to RIFTS (TM): Warlords of Russia. For Elite military OCCs, costing all Secondary Skills, half the OCC Related Skills plus possibly another cost like reduction in cybernetics/starting equipment. Fuck no, that is crazy.)

Savate: a French form of kickboxing that is apparently extremely effective in street fighting. 2 attacks, bunch of stat boosts, Circular Parry, plenty of kicks, and once per round, if he wins Initiative, can unleash a double-kick, making one kick attack then immediately making the next kick attack, with only half bonuses. "No grappling is taught". "Holds/Locks: Leg Lock, Elbow Lock". Okay then. Of note is that if you do this when the opponent is prone, you can perform the lock with your feet. That could be handy in RIFTS (TM) for locking in a figure-four or something then gunning some other asshole down with an E-Rifle. Can take one physical skill from a short list that includes Gymnastics, and can take one MA Tech or swap it out. Gets a fair amount of attacks and bonuses to Initiative, which are great - if you win Initiative, after all, you basically have a bonus attack each round that shares the "action count" with another attack. A-

Pentjak Silat/Arnis + Eskrima: Filipino art of wrecking someone's shit with a pair of batons. 4 base attacks, Power Parry, Combo Parry/Attack, a bunch of strikes and throws and joint locks, Katas for knife, short sword, short blunt and paired (any of the above in any combination). Also even when holding two weapons they can still use all of the moves available. One physical skill of ch-Boxing, two abilities from MA Techs or Katas or Body Hardening, can swap for physical skills. Gets a bunch of extra stuff all around, including bonus levels to the Weapon Proficiencies and eventually a Deathblow like the Boxer's KO: don't declare, a Natural 20 is just a flat-out Deathblow. It's pretty good so I give it an A.

And that is it. All done.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:12 am

Koumei wrote:Well, as a smaller combatant, if attacked I pretty much need to either take someone down with a punch to the throat, or initiate a throw and then choke them out without waiting for them to attack me first. Because standing there and letting someone else attempt to stab you with a knife, even when you are anticipating the attack, sounds like a really stupid idea.

Not really, no. As a smaller person who is generally not running around starting shit, you can expect most combats to begin by having someone larger and stronger than you striking or grabbing you. That is not a good place to be, but the reality is that is the point combat music is most likely to start for you: you being gabbed by someone stronger than you or you have just been hit hard enough to knock you off your feet.

The self defense techniques of most use to you are escapes and rolls, not throat jabs and snap kicks.

-Username17

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:33 am

Well when you get to THAT point the best method is to wear a nuclear bomb-vest and carry a deadman trigger.

But assuming the punch isn't a direct knockout or something that causes a crippling injury (and I can't make that assumption), yes, I'd want to roll. And then ???? because I imagine few people wander up, punch someone, then just walk off. So there is a new problem to deal with, one best handled through vanishing (I am not a ninja) or going for some mixture of "acting fast" and "horrifying violence". Similarly, if grabbed, they probably have some kind of ongoing goal so you want to escape, then cripple them before they just try again.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:22 am

The harsh reality is that a fight you don't start doesn't begin with each person in their corner and a ringing bell. It starts because someone sucker punches you or grabs you. Yes, there are scenarios where conflict starts with someone threatening you, but that shouldn't be a fight because you should run the fuck away unless they have a gun in which case you should give them the money out of your wallet.

So the beginning of the fight is that you just got punched in the stomach or the face. You may have a broken nose at this point (I certainly did), and you may be falling down. Now you get to start making choices and using whatever martial training you have.

What you don't want is to hit the concrete with a dull thump and have the wind knocked out of you or crack your head on the ground. Because if you lie there for a few seconds in a daze, the next thing that is going to happen is that someone is going to kick you in the ribs or stomp on your face. You want to hit the ground rolling, get back up, and put some distance between you and the person who just sucker punched you. Then you can start looking for an opening to get the fuck out of there. And you can start dodging and blocking now that you know things are "on."

And yes, it is sometimes valuable to hit back. But you're doing that to force your attacker to spend some time and thought on their own defense. While it is viscerally satisfying to knock one of your attackers onto the ground hard enough to make a sound like opening a soda can, that's not the goal. The goal is to get out alive without any more injuries than the ones you sustained in the surprise assault. Crippling one or more of your attackers is a distant tertiary goal to your own survival. You're not Batman. You're not the one starting this shit. You "win" if you get away alive.

Contrariwise, if you are the person starting this shit, you basically got one free shot to make it count. And that's where hard styles like Tai Kwan Do comes in handy. To make your first strike be the last strike, or at least set you up for a combination where they never hit back or even get back on their feet. A street fight is very much not like a fight in any movie. It should be decided one way or the other in less than 20 seconds.

-Username17

pragma · Post by **pragma** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:43 am

Mask_De_H wrote:If you're going to a Wu Shu dojo to learn "self-defense", they assume you're learning it for "fucking people up". Which is why they laughed at a defensive art and told you to to learn an art for fucking people up.

I expect the wushu school just wanted to be 100% sure no one studied there to learn to fight anyone at all unless a choreographer was also involved. I practiced wushu for many years and everyone in the room knew that it was for show and not for any kind of practical use. In fact, we repeated the mantra "don't use this, just run away" on a regular basis to drive that home.

Aside: some traditional Chinse martial arts might be significantly more useful than the modern form I'm gently, lovingly mocking (it does look cool, after all). I make no claims on Hung Gar, Baji, Fanzi, Shaolin Boxing, Seven Star Mantis, Cha'Chuan or many others.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:45 am

I don't have much confidence in my ability to outrun someone even if I haven't just been punched. And ideally I'd rather not turn my back so they have another free attack. If there are other people around or it's right near a place where there are people, that's another matter.

Back on topic I have no expansions explicitly for this game, so I won't be covering them. I will just reiterate that it's possible for any RIFTS (TM) character to use a mutation optional rule to qualify for any of these, and then stack different things together to punch and kick like an air strike. And the Big Show calls his punch the WMD.

sendaz · Post by **sendaz** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:09 am

Koumei wrote: Krav Mahga: this is the ONLY MARTIAL ART TAUGHT TO MILITARY (except for judo, boxing, collegiate wrestling and a few others). And obviously, MOSSAD use this as their main form of killing people - they don't use guns and just rely on this in a pinch, no, they kick your entire house down so it LOOKS like they bombed it, and then- yeah okay, basically what I'm saying is this has hilarious levels of Internet wankery over it. Not that it needs to be ineffective, as long as you do study it the way military people do: in a way that involves hobbling home from classes and stitching your face back together. But I like to think there's someone reading this who has a huge hard-on over Krav Mahga, and who is going to be really pissed off reading this.

If you really want to get them wound up, refer to their MA as Krav Mac & Cheese.

Though be prepared to fight or flight depending on their sense of humor.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:18 am

The first time I accidentally called it Grav Mahga. Then I realised that needs to be a zero-G martial art and if no sci-fi setting has used this, I will be really disappointed.

Berkserker · Post by **Berkserker** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:09 pm

Frank, that sounds a lot like pretty much what I hear from people who do have the misfortune of shit starting around them. One of the best things I keep hearing about 'soft' styles is not that they teach you to fight on the ground, but that you'll learn to fall right and, hopefully, not get stunned and consequently fucked up. I've known high level judokas who keep a decoy wallet so they can fuck off instead of busting out armbars because it's not worth it.

As for Krav Maga, I'm pretty much immediately skeptical about any bragging rights that involve military use. As a former soldier and, thanks to my work schedule (and let's be honest, lack of motivation) rather mediocre martial artist, I'm pretty sure that all combatives is good for, for most soldiers, is 1) making them feel ARMY STRONG, and 2) teaching them enough to get the shit kicked out of them in a barfight. The best you can really say about it is that maybe if someone is really, really well-trained, they'll be able to hold off some asshole with a knife long enough for a buddy to show up with his weapon before they get stabbed to death.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 1:16 pm

Berkserker wrote:The best you can really say about it is that maybe if someone is really, really well-trained, they'll be able to hold off some asshole with a knife long enough for a buddy to show up with his weapon before they get stabbed to death.

Bullshido used those exact words when explaining how the IDF actually uses it.

Also if someone else reviews White Wolf: Street Fighter, we can compare the shitty games and discuss which is the worst.

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 3:48 pm

From what I've heard, the military martial arts are pretty much the best methods of killing people with your bare hands and also killing people with your bare hands is incredibly difficult and if at all possible you should not try to do it.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:18 pm

Killing someone with my bare hands* is not actually on my list of things to do this year.

*or at all

talozin · Post by **talozin** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:34 pm

Koumei wrote:I don't have much confidence in my ability to outrun someone even if I haven't just been punched. And ideally I'd rather not turn my back so they have another free attack. If there are other people around or it's right near a place where there are people, that's another matter.

The thing is, running after someone is work. Unless someone is jumping out of an alley because they hate you specifically (in which case you're likely fucked whatever you do), they're probably doing it because they're looking for a low-effort way to make money. Chasing you down means they risk tripping over something and hurting themselves, running into a cop, running into some dude who thinks he's Charles Bronson, or just burning up a bunch of energy and still not catching you. Fuck that noise. Someone else they can beat the shit out of for fun and/or profit will be along soon enough, and they probably won't have to chase that guy down.

People in the U.S. go to sometimes extravagant lengths in the name of "self-defense", but the truth is that investing time and money in learning how to fight with your bare hands/pepper spray/knife/gun/whatever will not do you nearly as much good, in almost any plausible self-defense scenario, as having 1) good situational awareness and 2) good cardio. Running away is one of the most effective self-defense techniques possible and should always be your first choice, so getting good at it -- and getting good at recognizing that it's time to do so before you get a halfbrick to the skull -- are by far your best bang for the buck.

Count Arioch the 28th · Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:29 pm

lol, me running away from anything is not happening. That's not a boast, that's a physical limitation. Even when I was at my height of physical fitness I wasn't fast enough to outrun anything.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:47 pm

Koumei wrote:The instructor for Wu Shu was honest enough to say "You probably want to go with Muay Thai then, not what we're offering."

Muay thai gets a lot of respect as a foundation for self-defense but that's because it is one of the few striking arts where even the sport form allows for some basic clinch work. The part where you learn to spam tiger knees is cool and all, but the fact that a lot of your drills will start you off by defending against a collar tie of some sort is just as valuable. It's not as in-depth as judo or wrestling, but it's a decent compromise.

Judging__Eagle · Post by **Judging__Eagle** » Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:11 am

The real irony is that Krav Maga isn't that it's all that about its techniques (if it was; then good, accredited, KM instructors wouldn't constantly be teaching their students other martial arts to give them more strking/grappling choices), so much as it is a psychological tool that is designed to help the baseline, non-aggressive, human, be able to turn on, and turn off, their aggression at the drop of a hat. Since the largest hurdle in making someone able to actually defend themselves is their will to do so, Krav Maga is very much focused to give that killer instinct to any civilian in 6 months of lessons a couple times a week (or in a couple of weeks on intensive training). The best demonstration of this focus on mental contioning is Krav Maga instructor accreditation. Accredited instructors aren't tested specifically on their techniques or skills for their final examination; but their psychological endurance. Specifically, in being able to take down about 100 other Krav Maga instructed opponents in a row. Mostly to see if they can go beyond reasonable situations; so that they know its possible for the mind to push the body beyond the nervous system's complaints.

Most of the actual techniques specific to Krav Maga are actually more like "survival tricks" against guns and knives. Really, your overall techniques will come from other sources and most of the groundwork or striking one might learn from an accredited Krav Maga instructor will come from their other martial arts training. You're just as likely to learn Karate for strikes, Thai kickboxing for blocks, and Gracie (i.e. Brazilian) Juijutsu for your grappling.

It's also a more intensive training than one might find offered elsewhere. After doing a year or so of Krav Maga, my brother was helping their instructor by teaching children's karate (i.e. ~6 year olds; you just do the forms/sparring in slow motion; kids do get it) and adult judo classes. His accreditation for karate and judo were given to him by his instructor; and he got his Black Belts in karate and judo in a fraction of the time it would take someone actually studying those martial arts. Basically, if you want a black belt in a martial art; don't study it, but study Krav Maga under an accredited instructor who also teaches the martial art you want to rank up in in under a demidecade.

Most of this has to do with the fact that Krav Maga is meant for "actual" use from its first lesson; and isn't going to be prissy or exclusive in what it does or which martial arts it will be borrowing techniques from. Yes, it is a martial art; but its core is "whatever works", and its totally willing to give its students shortcuts to the entire suite of techniques of any other martial art style.

Some of the specifics that Krav Maga specifically covers that other martial arts don't implicitly include in their techniques:

-Being executed/shot: Specifically enemies with guns within 3 feet of you (although the overall rule is more like 30 feet; 3 feet allows more proactive actions); or pointing guns (execution style) at your head: by learning the specific movements that best get out of the way of being shot at in the immediate now; then how to hold a semi-auto pistol by the barrel so that it won't fire again (or at least keep it pointed away from you if its something like a revolver or long arm); using one's grip on the barrel to disarm and simultaneously break the gun user's index finger with their own gun (in classes, the "gun user" isn't supposed to ever place their finger within the trigger area in the heavy rubber mock guns because they will have their fingers snapped and broken)

-Knife-weilding enemies: Facing, Disarming, and stabbing/slashing techniques against a person with a knife trying to stab you; taking their knife; and killing them with it

-Being able to recognize danger; dangerous areas; dangerous people

-Being fit; being able to run. As Frank mentioned earlier; ESCAPE is the best solution to being stabbed or shot at. Not being stabbed or shot is the best way to survive someone trying to stab or shoot you. This is the sort of common sense combat training humans don't instinctively have, and it needs to be drilled into their heads to not "be an Hero".

-Being able to recognize weapons, and the fact you are never totally unarmed; the brim of your baseball hat; the hot liquid in your coffee; the newspaper/magazine rolled up in your hand; your keys shoved between your fingers in a fist; anything that is a force multiplier, lever, damaging substance, or arm-extension, is a potential weapon you can use to defend yourself.

-Lots of "non classroom" instruction; a good Krav Maga studio will have an intentionally mixed paved parking lot in concrete, asphalt and gravel. While having some amount of fencing to give variety when using brick walls. Wrestling on the street feels different than on a fighting mat; and you can overcome the initial shock by doing it a lot beforehand.

-Lots of "in classroom" practice; if you're good, you'll be able to force Police Officers to the ground, or make them tap out. If you're not, you're the Police Officers with authority complexes, who end up performing poorly in Krav Maga

It's never the be-all, nor end-all; someone with Krav Maga is going to have a tough time against someone who has Sambo (counters, joint strikes; and other N.Chinse MA pramaticisms); or Mua Thai (mostly b/c it's a MA designed to counter other MAs). The specific place for KM is to bootstrap anyone to be able to defend themselves in under a year; when most martial arts take years, if not decades, to master.

As for Sambo; anyone who is led to believe Sambo is really focused on grapples, locks, pins or bodyslams is curious, as I've never once heard of any of those associated with Sambo ever in my life. I'm going to assume one knows of Zangief; and one assumes that since they're Russian, and the Russians developed Sambo in '38, that for some reason Zangief uses the military, non-sporting, martial art Sambo; when his costuming indicates that he's more like an olypmics style wrestler than a revolutionary communist martial artist.

The fact that Rifts' Sambo martial art doesn't have joint strikes is really the most interesting to me; as it's the only major aspect of Sambo other than it's insanely maddening focus on counters. If you know someone is adept at Sambo, you probably can't be bothered to fight them in a remotely normal manner, and you'll likely have to do stupid/sneaky things to keep them guessing. Also, many of their counters turn into joint strikes; so you're better off just shooting at them than trying to think you should go toe-to-toe with them.

erik · Post by **erik** » Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:46 am

Judging__Eagle wrote: As for Sambo; anyone who is led to believe Sambo is really focused on grapples, locks, pins or bodyslams is curious, as I've never once heard of any of those associated with Sambo ever in my life. I'm going to assume one knows of Zangief; and one assumes that since they're Russian, and the Russians developed Sambo in '38, that for some reason Zangief uses the military, non-sporting, martial art Sambo; when his costuming indicates that he's more like an olypmics style wrestler than a revolutionary communist martial artist.

Wat? Not Sambo?

Sambo can fuck off then.

p.s.

Also, many of their counters turn into joint strikes; so you're better off just shooting at them than trying to think you should go toe-to-toe with them.

That reeks of the same odor as katana worship.

This goes for a physically robust individual with copious training in any martial art. Sambo isn't a special snowflake there.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:58 am

Honestly, Zangief's style is very much based on professional wrestling (in turn based on catch-as-catch-can. Ey-oop, me ducks). And if he existed in real life, Vince McMahon would get his happy face and try to sign him on ASAP. Firstly because "scary foreign man" never gets old (in his eyes), bonus points for SCARY RUSSIAN MAN (the Cold War is still on, right?), and also because he seems to really have a thing for massive, crazy-muscular men. Not necessarily sexual (obviously I'm not going to say it's wrong if it IS a sexual thing), he just really likes that and tries to have the main event be full of big muscular men with FOUR LAYERS OF PECS.

So, here's a bonus question someone sent in (I'm lying, they didn't): "So a Ninja in N&SS sucks the very plums the Phoenix Eye kicks. I want to be a Palladium (TM) Ninja, what should I do?"

I'm glad you asked, fictitious person! Here are the options aside from this book:
-Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: you can be a mutant wolvering lava warlock from the moon who utilises ninjutsu and pilots a mecha. From the moon. (Ask Frank for more details on how fucking awesome that is both mechanically and from a "I am twelve and you just kept adding awesome words" perspective.)
-RIFTS (TM): this offers more options than you might think. There's the Mystic Ninja, which is largely "Martial Arts: Ninjutsu" as a character. You can spend a chunk of PPE to turn into an MDC creature (your attacks don't start dealing MD though), you get Stealth Powers at D&D Feat levels, and you get some other assorted stuff. Oh also you're a Major Psionic who can at level 6 create an energy cock like Karakuri Ninja Girl (psi-sword). Also gains extra bonuses for horsemanship and archery, and your skills don't suck. It's not awful.
-Or a Tech-Ninja! A commando good with technology and with limited cybernetics. However you CAN learn HtH: Ninjutsu (without gaining powers), and you can officially call yourself a ninja because it's in the name.
-Ninja Juicer! Hey it's in the name, it totally counts. Do this if your idea of Ninja is basically Revenge of Shinobi, where you run into secret facilities, kick everyone in the face and then blow it all up. Can't take Ninjutsu.
-Ninja Crazy! Sneak, sneak, snea- AAAAAH! A SPIDER! AAAAAAAAAAAAAH! This idea is terrible even by the metric of having playable crazies to begin with. Has ninja in the name, doesn't learn Ninjutsu.
-Ninja Borg! You get to be a cyborg ninja (you don't get Ninjutsu). This is everything a kid could want (and if you can find a way to get reliable repairs to your cyber body, is a solid character option).
-Ninja Techno Wizard! Doesn't get Ninjutsu and also the picture really looks like a Papa Shango style African witchdoctor thing.
-Oni Ninja: in Phase World (TM), they introduce a race of demonic-looking people called the Oni. They have a very Japanese style society and speak a language similar to Japanese, but they don't actually come from Earth, let alone Japan. Followers of Amaterasu, apparently. Anyway they can become their own special style of Ninja. Very rad, they become MDC creatures permanently, and with Supernatural Strength, they don't learn Ninjutsu but they do get magical ninja powers. Possibly the best choice if you want to write "Ninja" on your character sheet.

I have now probably dragged this review out as far as it can go with extra bits and pieces.