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Sacrificial Lamb
Apprentice


Joined: 05 Jul 2009
Posts: 74
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:18 am    Post subject: Hello, new people. Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Greetings, new life forms. I'm Sacrificial Lamb, a previous semi-regular poster on the rpgsite. I took a long break from frequent online posting to deal with annoyingly bitter real life bullshit. Now I've reached a point where I don't know if I feel comfortable posting on therpgsite any more due to the 5e fellatio that occurs there with such alarming frequency.

Like yourselves, I'm more of a 3.x gamer...though I do still like AD&D and other old-school D&D games. However, I absolutely loathe 5e, and hate it with the fire of a thousand burning suns. I'm actually tempted to write a review, just to purge myself of the cancerous anti-logic of this new edition. Maybe I'll do it soon, just for the lulz. We'll see...

Come to think of it, I'd have posted a review of 5e already, but I'm recovering from pneumonia, and have lately felt like I've been trampled by a herd of unruly goats. When I feel a little better, I'll give my two bits on 5e...and what it means for the hobby.

Anyway, hi.
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Lago PARANOIA
Invincible Overlord


Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 10157

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Welcome, Sacrificial Lamb.

And as far as the 5E D&D review, I say go for it. TGD loves hateviews, nostalgic reviews, and purely informative ones. It's one way to leave a helluva first impression.
_________________
Josh Kablack wrote:
Your freedom to make rulings up on the fly is in direct conflict with my freedom to interact with an internally consistent narrative. Your freedom to run/play a game without needing to understand a complex rule system is in direct conflict with my freedom to play a character whose abilities and flaws function as I intended within that ruleset. Your freedom to add and change rules in the middle of the game is in direct conflict with my ability to understand that rules system before I decided whether or not to join your game.

In short, your entire post is dismissive of not merely my intelligence, but my agency. And I don't mean agency as a player within one of your games, I mean my agency as a person. You do not want me to be informed when I make the fundamental decisions of deciding whether to join your game or buying your rules system.
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Sacrificial Lamb
Apprentice


Joined: 05 Jul 2009
Posts: 74
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Lago PARANOIA wrote:
Welcome, Sacrificial Lamb.

And as far as the 5E D&D review, I say go for it. TGD loves hateviews, nostalgic reviews, and purely informative ones. It's one way to leave a helluva first impression.


Thank you for the welcome. I am definitely going to post a 5e review, but I might need a few days to recover before I get around to it. In my current state, clear and coherent thought uses up some of my energy reserves....so I might need a little more time if I want to properly review 5e, and compare it with other editions of D&D.

I've lurked on this website for years, and never posted....until now. I had totally forgotten that I had an account here. Never used it, and never thought that I would. It's strange how things turn out.
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Windjammer
Master


Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Hello, new people. Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Sacrificial Lamb wrote:
Greetings, new life forms. I'm Sacrificial Lamb, a previous semi-regular poster on the rpgsite. I took a long break from frequent online posting to deal with annoyingly bitter real life bullshit. Now I've reached a point where I don't know if I feel comfortable posting on therpgsite any more due to the 5e fellatio that occurs there with such alarming frequency.

Like yourselves, I'm more of a 3.x gamer...though I do still like AD&D and other old-school D&D games. However, I absolutely loathe 5e, and hate it with the fire of a thousand burning suns. I'm actually tempted to write a review, just to purge myself of the cancerous anti-logic of this new edition. Maybe I'll do it soon, just for the lulz. We'll see...

Come to think of it, I'd have posted a review of 5e already, but I'm recovering from pneumonia, and have lately felt like I've been trampled by a herd of unruly goats. When I feel a little better, I'll give my two bits on 5e...and what it means for the hobby.

Anyway, hi.


Welcome, and my best wishes on you recuperation.

Also, welcome in terms of joining 'the club' in terms of forum migration. About the only person left to respect who's still posting there it's One Horse Town (Dan); the rest have either left, or only the 5e fellaters are left. The forum used to be incredibly cool, but it has now shrunk to the size of around 12-15 regulars (if that) who basically pretend that this post here:

http://jrients.blogspot.nl/2008/07/4e-reader-response.html

never happened. Apparently, it was totally cool, as an OSR person (who's the typical 5e afficionado) to discern trolling for what it was, when it came to 4e fanboy defense mechanisms; but 4 years on, Pundit is on the game's payroll, and the forum does not just call bull on such trolling, but enforces it in thread.after.thread. JRients left, of course, as have many other notables, including Settembrini, Melan, and even Benoist (not the same caliber, but he did care a lot for keeping the bullshit meter relatively low), the latter an explicit target of Pundit's antics as 'paid consulter'.

Two things for now -

1. I've not given up on TheRpgSite. I still want to see what happens within 5e's life span - the line may cancel soon, and then those 12-15 guys will have a harder time keeping up what they're doing to the site now, but then again I don't care - and most importantly, I have my hopes up for the site once 6e comes rolling in, and someone actually interested in design and mechanics writes 900 pages of an actual game.

2. Please do post your 5e review here. No need for vitriol, I think. I share your low esteem of the edition, but I'd really prefer to simply read an honest break down of your misgivings. Relatively sober critique has become so rare, and any critique free of vitriol or unwarranted degrees of caution to stave off the ever looming ire of the fanboys - now that would be refreshing to read.

Just my 5 cents, and to repeat - welcome here, and I think you made a wise decision, even if (a) traffic is low here and (b) this site is, if anything, even more given to group think than TheRPGSite. It just happens that I mostly find it inoffensive, if often tedious or simply remote from my actual gaming interests. I recommend browsing the 'DrunkenReview' threads on the site, for starters, as some of the more entertaining and better material.


Last edited by Windjammer on Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Sacrificial Lamb
Apprentice


Joined: 05 Jul 2009
Posts: 74
Location: USA

PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:55 am    Post subject: Re: Hello, new people. Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Windjammer wrote:
Sacrificial Lamb wrote:
Greetings, new life forms. I'm Sacrificial Lamb, a previous semi-regular poster on the rpgsite. I took a long break from frequent online posting to deal with annoyingly bitter real life bullshit. Now I've reached a point where I don't know if I feel comfortable posting on therpgsite any more due to the 5e fellatio that occurs there with such alarming frequency.

Like yourselves, I'm more of a 3.x gamer...though I do still like AD&D and other old-school D&D games. However, I absolutely loathe 5e, and hate it with the fire of a thousand burning suns. I'm actually tempted to write a review, just to purge myself of the cancerous anti-logic of this new edition. Maybe I'll do it soon, just for the lulz. We'll see...

Come to think of it, I'd have posted a review of 5e already, but I'm recovering from pneumonia, and have lately felt like I've been trampled by a herd of unruly goats. When I feel a little better, I'll give my two bits on 5e...and what it means for the hobby.

Anyway, hi.


Welcome, and my best wishes on you recuperation.

Also, welcome in terms of joining 'the club' in terms of forum migration. About the only person left to respect who's still posting there it's One Horse Town (Dan); the rest have either left, or only the 5e fellaters are left. The forum used to be incredibly cool, but it has now shrunk to the size of around 12-15 regulars (if that) who basically pretend that this post here:

http://jrients.blogspot.nl/2008/07/4e-reader-response.html

never happened. Apparently, it was totally cool, as an OSR person (who's the typical 5e afficionado) to discern trolling for what it was, when it came to 4e fanboy defense mechanisms; but 4 years on, Pundit is on the game's payroll, and the forum does not just call bull on such trolling, but enforces it in thread.after.thread. JRients left, of course, as have many other notables, including Settembrini, Melan, and even Benoist (not the same caliber, but he did care a lot for keeping the bullshit meter relatively low), the latter an explicit target of Pundit's antics as 'paid consulter'.

Two things for now -

1. I've not given up on TheRpgSite. I still want to see what happens within 5e's life span - the line may cancel soon, and then those 12-15 guys will have a harder time keeping up what they're doing to the site now, but then again I don't care - and most importantly, I have my hopes up for the site once 6e comes rolling in, and someone actually interested in design and mechanics writes 900 pages of an actual game.

2. Please do post your 5e review here. No need for vitriol, I think. I share your low esteem of the edition, but I'd really prefer to simply read an honest break down of your misgivings. Relatively sober critique has become so rare, and any critique free of vitriol or unwarranted degrees of caution to stave off the ever looming ire of the fanboys - now that would be refreshing to read.

Just my 5 cents, and to repeat - welcome here, and I think you made a wise decision, even if (a) traffic is low here and (b) this site is, if anything, even more given to group think than TheRPGSite. It just happens that I mostly find it inoffensive, if often tedious or simply remote from my actual gaming interests. I recommend browsing the 'DrunkenReview' threads on the site, for starters, as some of the more entertaining and better material.


Windjammer, thank you for your kind post. I remember you from therpgsite, and you've always struck me as a rational poster. I'm feeling a little bit better after visiting the hospital last night, and I'm slowly recovering. If I hadn't felt like a sick festering goat for over the past month, I would have already posted a review of 5e by now.

And I'll just say it:

therpgsite has jumped the shark. I'm not saying that I've entirely given up on therpgsite either, but life has conspired to make me a lot crankier than I was a few years ago. My ability to tolerate nonsense has reduced.

The 5e shilling on that site has gotten really bad. Pundit has been co-opted by WoTC....simply by them pandering to his massive ego, and Sacrosanct is an annoying 5e shill.

I will soon write a highly detailed rant on the poorly-written E6 clusterfuck that 5e has become, but I simply can't promise that it will be vitriol-free. I'll probably engage in some rabid foaming of the mouth. I'm at that point now, as I've been playing 5e with my friends lately...and I simply cannot create the characters I could in earlier editions, or even recreate various scenarios that other editions would allow to happen.

Basically, I call 5e "The Decepticon Edition"....as it's nothing that it promised to be, but deceives people into believing that 5e is something that it is not. I'll explain this statement soon. I have more oxygen in my brain than I did yesterday, so I'll be posting my 5e rant in the near future.


Last edited by Sacrificial Lamb on Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:56 am; edited 1 time in total
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Windjammer
Master


Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Thanks for your response, and I'm glad to hear your state is getting better and better.

Can't even begin to say how much I agree with the label 'Deception Edition'. I'm still waiting for someone to line up the 2012 list of promises Mearls made for this game, and compare it to the result we got. I admit the comparison will benefit immensely coming from you, rather than someone like me who hasn't played the game. While I resent the fact that 'not having played a game (at campaign length)' now disqualifies reviewer status, I of course do agree that having played and experienced a game in first person does help put things in perspective. So good luck with your review, and remember that life is too short to waste it on inferior things. Smile
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Windjammer
Master


Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Sorry, one more thing:

Sacrosanct is not a shill. Not strictly speaking. To be a shill, he'd have to be pushing the game for WotC's sake and on WotC's terms. But he isn't. He's a freelance writer who's been working for months on writing an 'old school' module for 5e that he wants to charge real money for. For that product to sell, he has to have customers. His primary group of customers will already be playing and running 5e, and not converting to do so purely on the basis of a new module. So if you pay attention, you'll note that he defends the ruleset to the hilt, but has no hesitation to point out how awful the modules are 5e has seen to date (first and foremost of course the Kobold Press ones funded by WotC). In other words, 'buy this edition, but not the official modules, buy my module that's coming out'.

Which is shilling in a sense, but not Pundit's, who's openly saying that having a free PDF without chargen is the best invention the world of RPGs has seen. I still laugh when I remember that. I'm 100% sure he's too smart to not see that that is bull. Where I'm offended and stunned, however, is that RPG fora like Enworld and RPGSite have led to a huge exodus, leaving behind only shills and those unsuspecting of the degree to which commercial self-interests drive forum discussion, or what's left of it.


Last edited by Windjammer on Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:25 pm; edited 3 times in total
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