5e - under or overpowered shit

General questions, debates, and rants about RPGs

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Lago PARANOIA
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Post by Lago PARANOIA »

Dean wrote:I'm telling you that your instincts for decent design are creating, whole cloth, rules that don't exist in the game. They should exist but they don't. This isn't 3E, this isn't even 4E which at least had the balls to tell you it's rules even though the rules were bullshit. This is 5E and it won't even look you in the eye and tell you how it works. Mike Mearls is a coward, everything he has ever done is a demonstration of that and his cowardice has seeped into every aspect of these rules. 5E has the same goals as 4E, that is to strip away character empowerment and their ability to interact with the world in any way that isn't grinding mobs for XP, but unlike 4E it isn't even willing to write clear rules to that matter. The game wants to give you nothing whenever possible but it is too cowardly to even stand by that post. It wants to give you no abilities but that would cause backlash so it gives you hundreds of overlapping mutually exclusive abilities. It wants to give you no loot but that has caused backlash so it writes rules in three separate parts of the book that altogether tell you that monsters actually don't drop anything except what your DM decides. It wants you to play at 3rd level forever but that has caused backlash so it simply gives abilities with no respect to level so that your 17th level power and your 4th level power may be identical (as the bard can attest).
Ohhhh, yes, that's the good shit. That's what makes pappy Lago happy. :sexface: More hatred, MORE HATRED!
Josh Kablack wrote:Your freedom to make rulings up on the fly is in direct conflict with my freedom to interact with an internally consistent narrative. Your freedom to run/play a game without needing to understand a complex rule system is in direct conflict with my freedom to play a character whose abilities and flaws function as I intended within that ruleset. Your freedom to add and change rules in the middle of the game is in direct conflict with my ability to understand that rules system before I decided whether or not to join your game.

In short, your entire post is dismissive of not merely my intelligence, but my agency. And I don't mean agency as a player within one of your games, I mean my agency as a person. You do not want me to be informed when I make the fundamental decisions of deciding whether to join your game or buying your rules system.
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Deathfork
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Post by Deathfork »

Dean wrote:
Deathfork wrote:(Unless you're suggesting that this is 4e all over again and the bow is an inherent piece of the skeleton that is irreplaceable.)
I'm telling you that your instincts for decent design...
D'aww, shucks. :loveya:

But seriously, I've had this same argument with two people IRL already that were trying to tell me "3rd is back but better!", And my point was, "No, they mashed up the worst part of 3rd and 4th, but you can't tell because, to you, formatting = rules."
90% of the complaints of 3tards had about 4th made it into the game, and now they're fine with it.
Also 90% of the complaints 4rries had about 3rd made it into the game.
So the game, by my calculations, is 180% bullshit.
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Rawbeard
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Post by Rawbeard »

I am not a smart man, so sometimes I need a moment to figure stuff out. I just realized identify is a ritual spell. Why the fuck would anyone ever cast that shit as a ritual? by staring blankly at a magical item for one hour you not only save money, but also 1 minute of your life and get the same result. Like... WTF? Also, since there is no "adventurers only" tag to the blank stare of identification, every fucking peasant can do that shit. Also apparently everyone ever knows the specific tastes of every potion, but that is another bag of stupid.

I don't mind that shit being easy to identify, it's not 1970 anymore, but at least pretend like it makes sense.

GWARF.
Last edited by Rawbeard on Thu Aug 21, 2014 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
To a man with a hammer every problem looks like a nail.
Axebird
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Post by Axebird »

Pretty sure rituals are free. By having identify you can identify items six times faster!

Which isn't exactly a useful ability, but at least it does something.
Insomniac
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Post by Insomniac »

So Warlocks have to shoot multiple blasts instead of one potent blast. Problem is, one Class ability allows you to add charisma to the damage of Eldritch Blast. Now, does this apply one time or many times? The 5veMind boggles.

Somebody told me this is a high level controversy already at the WOTC forums. It shouldn't mean too much since scores are capped at 20, but there you have it.
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Deathfork
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Post by Deathfork »

Insomniac wrote:So Warlocks have to shoot multiple blasts instead of one potent blast. Problem is, one Class ability allows you to add charisma to the damage of Eldritch Blast. Now, does this apply one time or many times? The 5veMind boggles.

Somebody told me this is a high level controversy already at the WOTC forums. It shouldn't mean too much since scores are capped at 20, but there you have it.
By RAW it applies to all of them, and is not over powered. Unless you take two levels of warlock and take the rest as sorcerer, in which case, you're dealing more single target damage than anything else, except a Necromancer.

Also, while not relevant to OP's particular situation, I just noticed that True Polymorph give you legendary actions, and can transform your entire party into a bunch of good aligned Adult Red Dragons. Or whatever bad-ass monster you want of a CR equal to your level. Pit Fiend? Sure. Permanently.
Last edited by Deathfork on Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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nockermensch
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Post by nockermensch »

I read the True Polymorph description again and yeah. Any class that's not pulling their weight by the time the wizard gets this becomes a CR 17 creature that's actually useful (angel? efreeti? storm giant?). Of course, no word of what happen if the guy being polymorphed first remove his items, then get polymorphed, then wear them back.

Want followers? Create a CR 9 angel for every day of downtime. True Polymorph lacks significative material costs and if you create a creature that's naturally aligned to whatever you're doing, you shouldn't have many problems convincing it to keep working for you.
@ @ Nockermensch
Koumei wrote:After all, in Firefox you keep tabs in your browser, but in SovietPutin's Russia, browser keeps tabs on you.
Mord wrote:Chromatic Wolves are massively under-CRed. Its "Dood to stone" spell-like is a TPK waiting to happen if you run into it before anyone in the party has Dance of Sack or Shield of Farts.
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Ferret
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Post by Ferret »

"Follow me, and become an immortal celestial being of power" has a certain ring to it.
Username17
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Post by Username17 »

Ferret wrote:"Follow me, and become an immortal celestial being of power" has a certain ring to it.
Especially when you say that to a dog.

Image

-Username17
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Ferret
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Post by Ferret »

Well of course I'm leaving off the fact that Bob over there is actually doing the Polymorphing, _I'm_ standing here with Planar Binding readied.

"Immortal celestial being of power ENSLAVED TO ME" just doesn't have quite the same je ne sais quoi.
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