Video Games

TarkisFlux · Post by **TarkisFlux** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:50 pm

Yay day 0 "get it for free if you don't buy used" DLC?

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:54 pm

The benefit of that is that it means I get to pretend they didn't add a party member from a race that was rendered rather thoroughly extinct and explicitly lacked stasis units that could run for a few hundred years without extremely powerful generators, never mind fifty thousand. It just doesn't make sense.

Now, a Prothean robot that got switched back on is something I could buy. But that is not what is going on.

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:30 am

Actually, it seems the DLC's in the Collector's Edition, but not the standard.

It is available for ten bucks, though.

And gives more than the Kasumi DLC (though not by much). So there's that, at least.

Personally, I'll keep an open mind until I specifically see how they handled the stasis and junk.

Not like it matters terribly much--I shelled out the extra twenty bucks for the Collector's Edition, in a fit of largesse.

Also, why is it called the Collector's Edition? Mass Effect 2 had the Collector's Edition.

This one should be the Reaper's Edition. *ba-dum TISH*

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 5:09 pm

I just finished that Amalur sidequest where you go find the ten books from that monk's collection, that begins in the very first town you're in.

Mega-spoiler warning

378 gold pieces?!? You sonofabitch, I spent ages tracking those books down! I spent more in fines the two times I had steal while being noticed than I got in loot! spkjighbpidfuhdfesbpuiyvgf-89qew nksp;azxkm

Jilocasin · Post by **Jilocasin** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 5:16 pm

I guess that's what the ability to go hostile and rampage on npcs is for. Also Total Biscuit has a long and semi-coherent rant about the Prothean DLC.

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 5:29 pm

Oh god, that sidequest. I was so incredibly pissed off by that bullshit tiny reward. It was the longest sidequest in the game, and I would have been pissed off to receive that little money back when I GOT the quest. The last book is two areas away from a up-to-forty item collection quest that gives three-four times as much gold PER ITEM. For a quest that long, I want a fucking Twist Of Fate.

Lago PARANOIA · Post by **Lago PARANOIA** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:24 pm

Any recommendations for good console/PC games like Final Fantasy Tactics or Shining Force or Tactics Ogre where you control a small squad of highly specialized characters and pit them against the same?

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:21 pm

Fire Emblem uses the ever-classic grid and definitely has more interesting maps, but lacks the character customizing. They also throw fuck-tons of characters at you, in a variety of classes, but usually only two members of any class (three at the outside) are really, truly worth using. This will not always be who you expect--Path of Radiance has a footsoldier named Nephenee who was an absolute BEAST. Add in limited healing and permanent character death/removal, and it forces you to pay close attention to what you're doing, who's where, and who you want to attack.

I don't know how it fared in other games, but in Path of Radiance and, I hear, Radiant Dawn, magic users -sucked ass-. They were a lot frailer than everyone else, and didn't do more damage than anyone else.

You rattled off most of the series I can think of in that vein, so, yeah. The only one I can think of that's left is Fire Emblem.

Parthenon · Post by **Parthenon** » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:13 am

I was thinking about suggesting Fire Emblem (Gamecube/Wii/DS) except that Lago wants specialised characters. And... they're only vaguely specialised.

I mean, the actual difference between a pegasus knight and a wyvern rider is... um? Until they're promoted they have the same weapon, they have pretty similar stats except pegasus knights getting more speed and wyverns getting a bit more health and defence, they both play pretty much the same role...

The main specialisation is the rock/paper/scissors aspect of the weapon with a tiny bit of archers against flying and similar, and at higher levels that just doesn't matter.

Important things to remember about Fire Emblem:
[*]Predefined characters you can't really customise
[*]Random level ups of stats so you can't always rely on anyone to be that good
[*]Perma-death of characters
[*]Always against a larger group so most enemies are mooks - tough ones, but still meant to be cannon fodder

But other than that it is a small squad of units against a larger group of units which I really enjoyed and would recommend. Just remember that if you really want customisation and specialisation, and want roughly equally sided battles then Fire Emblem doesn't quite fit.

EDIT: Which platforms do you have? DS/PS2or3/Wii/whatever? That will limit the games slightly and make it easier to suggest sensible games.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:37 am

Ess is still a fan of Brigandine for the PS1.

TarkisFlux · Post by **TarkisFlux** » Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:23 am

Even though I'm not particularly familiar with it, the Advance Wars series probably deserves a mention. Someone with more experience with it will need to tell you if it fits your criteria though.

[Edit] The Vandal Hearts series is a pretty decent fit for what you're looking for actually. Parts 1 and 2 are for the PS1, and they made a new one for XBLA / PSN recently.

[Edit 2] Also Disgaea, La Pucelle: Tactics, and Phantom Brave. Disgaea (and sequels) certainly fits the requirements. Koumei may be along shortly to tell you how awesome it is (and she'll be right). The others I don't have direct experience with, but I suspect Koumei might.

This wikipedia article did a fair job of jogging my memory on these, and contains some other tactical games you might be interested in looking at, though they don't match what you're looking for exactly.

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:07 am

I beat Amalur today. Making a Warrior-Mage character on Hard.

Also, is it me, or would alchemy mitigate most of the problems of being a pure caster or pure melee? There's potions to boost your total health/mana for either side, potions for reducing damage taken for mages...

It strikes me that maybe I didn't give it full credit on the playthrough I just wrapped up and in hindsight... I'll try experimenting on this point in this game, and just ignore Lockpicking or something. At least on this game, I'll be able to get all those crazy-fun armor sets that are warriors-only.

Anyways. That last boss was pretty awesome for its scale. Shame it doesn't attack that much on its own.

Blicero · Post by **Blicero** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:47 am

To Lago: I've heard nothing but praise for Silent Storm and the (older) Jagged Alliance games. They're both tactical turnbased topdown squadcontrol games. They aren't fantasy or SF, really, but they gameplay is supposed to be excellent.

Silent Storm is difficult to track down, but you could probably find a torrent or whatever. And Jagged Alliance 2 is on GOG for like 5 bucks.

Also, the new X-COM game Firaxis is making looks like it has the potential to be quite excellent.

PhoneLobster · Post by **PhoneLobster** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:51 am

Blicero wrote:the new X-COM game Firaxis

That's a surprise, and more interesting than the bullshit crappy name tag only X-Com FPS thing that was last seen floudering in development because of it's own stupidity.

But then again.

Firaxis did just do Civilization 5. So their recent record is pretty crap. But maybe they fired that one guy who seemed largely responsible.

Hell if you want really great stuff they haven't done anything all that good since Alpha Centauri.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:33 pm

Lago, have you tried Tactics Arena Online? It's pretty fun if you don't get paired up with the people who spent money on it. Most good players turn it into a poke-fest "geek the cleric" game, but it is what it is. It's sort of like a weird game of chess.

Advance Wars also can't be recommended highly enough. It's difficult even if you know the AI's quirks! It has so many features for a GBA game it will blow your mind. Custom maps, 4 player on one GBA, huge amount of premade maps, a hefty single-player campaign and even more single player from the War Room and any custom maps you make.

I bought that game a million years ago and still play it every once in a while.

Doom · Post by **Doom** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:22 pm

Maxus wrote:I just finished that Amalur sidequest where you go find the ten books from that monk's collection, that begins in the very first town you're in.

More or less just started Amalur.

Do you ever get a 'stash'? I rented a room, but there's nothing there for storage, as near as I can tell. I'm not having inventory issues yet, but I don't want to carry around set items for half the game, hoping to find the missing pieces.

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:35 pm

You get a couple of stashes, actually. First one is pretty close to the start in the Webwood, and you can access all your storage space from any stash location.

Doom · Post by **Doom** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:42 pm

Kewlio, thanks.

Blicero · Post by **Blicero** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:14 pm

PhoneLobster wrote: That's a surprise, and more interesting than the bullshit crappy name tag only X-Com FPS thing that was last seen floudering in development because of it's own stupidity.

There's some pretty thorough coverage of the game on RPS, starting with this interview: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/02 ... n-preview/

Now, I've never played any of the originals, so if/when I buy the remake I won't be able to see how they stack up. But the interviews give the impression that this is going to be a very interesting game. I am moderately interested in it, although the subpar nature of Civ 5 is mildly foreboding.

There's also apparently a more indie (and therefore faithful) remake of X-COM called Xenonauts that some other studio is doing, if you're srsly grognarding.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:04 am

at least 4 new Mech-Games this year . .
and not a single fucking real good mechwarrior or mechcommander -.-

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:15 am

Doom wrote:
Maxus wrote:I just finished that Amalur sidequest where you go find the ten books from that monk's collection, that begins in the very first town you're in.
More or less just started Amalur.

Do you ever get a 'stash'? I rented a room, but there's nothing there for storage, as near as I can tell. I'm not having inventory issues yet, but I don't want to carry around set items for half the game, hoping to find the missing pieces.

Five that I know of. Sidequest in Webwood (that town named Canneroc).

There's also two in the desert region, in the Hollowlands and Adessa respectively. The one is Adessa is available as soon as you come into town, you just can't upgrade it until you finish a pain-in-the-ass sidequest chain (and the house is HUGE). Then you also have a post-mainquest gift.

So, yeah. Head to the Webwood, and find the guy out in the open in the middle of town. Complete the quest, and you get the key to Gossamer End.

Upgrading Gossamer End is cheap, too. Six expansions at less than 500 a pop, and you get your own Sagecrafting and Alchemy workstations. And the grateful citizenry will drop off packs of spidersilk that you can sell (not an uncommon thing. Some of the houses come with property/etc that you can talk to someone to get your cut of the profits from).

And you get one if you have that arena DLC and beat it. Oddly, that house sucks the worst out of all of them. So does the one in Adessa, honestly. The former has nothing really going for it, and the later needs a monorail system for you to get somewhere without requiring a solid set of hiking boots and a native guide.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:21 am

TarkisFlux wrote:The Vandal Hearts series is a pretty decent fit for what you're looking for actually.

Yeah, though VH1 shows its age with the mechanics - no replaying maps (in a game with no NG+ and with special "miss it by not searching this specific tile? Well fuck you" collectables), and with a "Main character: essential late in the game, but if he ever dies you instantly lose the mission, so you need him to be out there killing stuff, but not doing TOO MUCH".

That said, those collectables? All they do is, once you gather them all and fight all the bonus maps (some of which can be quite hard), unlock the most broken class ever (for the main character).

Note that it was the first tactical I ever played, and I didn't have much trouble finishing it. As someone who kind of sucks at games. So it's fairly easy, but fun. The second one has a lot more tactical depth to it, more interesting mechanics to fiddle with, shame about losing the prestige class/tier system though, and I preferred the look of the first. But never mind, VH2 is certainly a good game.

Also Disgaea, La Pucelle: Tactics, and Phantom Brave. Disgaea (and sequels) certainly fits the requirements. Koumei may be along shortly to tell you how awesome it is (and she'll be right). The others I don't have direct experience with, but I suspect Koumei might.

Spoilered for tl;dr of going on about how much I love these games.

Absolutely. Disgaea 1 is possibly the hardest, and at the same time the least 1-hit-heaven (not including post-game stuff). Also, it is the strictest with the conditions you need to meet to get various endings. Things to grind: levels, money (a joke after a certain level), tiers for each race/class, attack/spell levels, weapon mastery levels, weapon levels (and I guess Customer Rank/Hospital Rewards, but whatever).

The second one has some of my favourite characters, and gets easier yet at the same time becomes a bit more 1-shot (as in, you rush in, one-shot enemies and don't let them counter, and try to clear the map in one turn). Also more lenient with the endings, and has some great endings to boot. Introduces only one (I think?) new thing to grind: Felonies.

Disgaea 3 & 4 fly into crazy town for 1-shotting everything, which can be a good or bad thing. No more felony grinding, but instead you get to grind through CHARACTER WORLD to grant new special abilities and minor stat boosts, and there are possibly yet more things to grind. Oh, beating pirates up/torturing captives so you can get rare ship parts (in 4), sure, and I suppose grinding Tree relationships (in 4). Disgaea 4 also looks gorgeous and includes the ability to raid other players online/share custom maps - but there's no actual PvP, if you send your dudes off to pester a friend, they rock up as AI enemies/allies when your friend plays.

I won't lie, the games expect you to do some grinding for the regular story. But not much - you can actually beat 3 and 4 at least just by going through each story level once and doing only one or two raids into the item world (which are story-required events anyway), if you want a "minimum requirements" challenge. Any extra is basically "Fuck it, I can't be bothered doing the required strategy for this level, can't I just bring a level 9999 catgirl out to kick everything in the face?" (yes, yes you can). Many maps will have some kind of trick to them that either means you can make a standard map somewhat easy or an unfairly-artificially-hard map standard, but the basic tactics and exploiting-the-AI will always help. And power-levelling if ever you get sick of that.

And for the record, there are ways to make said grind really really fast, it's not even a big deal.

La Pucelle actually has no New Game Plus (!!!) so needs a bit more care and thought put into it early-game. There is a sort of alternate end (which is apparently the canon end), but it requires stupid levels of grinding - but this can be done even in the first chapter if you're that bored, and doing it lets you convert even enemy bosses onto your team. It's a really fun game still, and I like their magic-colour-combo system. It's a fairly hard game to find.

Phantom Brave is fucking annoying. Okay, it's less funny by far, and is more serious, the tale of a young girl and the prejudice she faces while trying to make friends, and it's so very sad etc. But it's still nice. Just... god, a couple of the levels will really be hard. And only a couple. And the only "serious" way to grind levels and money and find rare weapons? Is the most merciless "Get used to seeing the game over screen/resetting" thing ever.

Requires more in the way of careful tactics and planning, as any unit can get summoned onto battle for only a few rounds - so every round has to count.

Makai Kingdom is a complete joy. It's at least as funny as Disgaea, and has plenty of stupidity to go around. Also introduces buildings (which you will use the fuck out of) and vehicles (which you will almost never use, except *maybe* as a turn-1 movement booster (summon onto field, move vehicle, jump out of vehicle, use your own movement, act).

Fair warning though. They are very... Japanese. I think that's the best way of putting it.

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:45 am

As an addendum to Koumei's Disgaea love, I will talk about Soul Nomad and The World Eaters.

It pretty much plays a lot like Ogre battle with each squad containing up to 9 units. The squads are placed in a room, which gives bonuses and sometimes special abilities. Some rooms have a limited number of spots and they are divided into three rows. Depending on the unit you can get different attacks. Also each squad has a leader that if that person is killed the squad is defeated.

The menu not really organized well and the story is a little dark and can get really dark if you take the evil path.

Those are just the ones developed by Nippon ichi. Don't get any developed by Idea Factory.

I will also recommend Eternal Poison by Flight Plan. It is sorta easy (I never got a game over by dieing), but it is pretty solid.

If you want really old I suggest:

Genesis:
Warsong (Langrisser 1)
Langrisser 2 (didn't come to the US, but there is an english patch)

Sega CD:
Dark Wizard,

Super Nes
FEDA: The Emblem of Justice,
some of the Front Mission Series

PS1
Vanguard Bandits
Growlanser series (very Japanese, more charge time)
Front Mission 3

PS2
Eternal Poison
Growlanser (More real time)

PSP
Jeanne D'arc

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:53 am

Pseudo Stupidity wrote:Lago, have you tried Tactics Arena Online? It's pretty fun if you don't get paired up with the people who spent money on it. Most good players turn it into a poke-fest "geek the cleric" game, but it is what it is. It's sort of like a weird game of chess.

TAO is back up again?

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 7:38 am

Leress wrote: Those are just the ones developed by Nippon ichi. Don't get any developed by Idea Factory.

Which tacticals have they made? I'm only familiar with their RPGs and the RPG-with-some-tactical-elements-ish mash-up game that is CrossXEdge.